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ATWT: Luke & Noah; Am I the only one who doesn't dig'em?
Topic Started: Aug 17 2007, 08:16 PM (672 Views)
SpiritualJunkie


I've never called the ATWT comment line before but last week, I took the plunge, said "What the hey" and called them up. No answer (hmm..they must be closed Fridays). So I left a message.

I pretty much commented about every storyline (except Carly/Jack/Katie/Brad..don't care about them at all) which I might save for another thread.

Now, first..I'll get this out in the open. I'm straight. That doesn't mean I'm going to hide behind the "I'm straight so I can't relate and therefore, don't care about this gay story that's happening on ATWT". I don't exactly have the urge to watch two males kissing or having sex (which I'm sure is what many Nuke fans wanna see) but I'm all for watching love stories.

Besides, hiding behind that excuse would make me a hypocrite since I've been sucked into liking romances between relatives (ie. GL's Tammy & Jonathan), victim/victimizers (ie. again...Tammy & Jonathan), younger woman/men old enough to be their father (ie. ATWT's Craig & Jennifer before Jennifer became a shrill beeyotch), etc...and no waay could I ever see myself in similar romantic relationships.

What I left in my message is that I think the Luke/Noah story has great potential. The idea of a gay romance between two men on daytime television is something that has yet to be fully explored so there's loads of potential for originality. However, Luke & Noah couldn't be any more boring the way they have been written for the most part.

I always got the sense that the media and soap fans (namely the online community) are clamoring for this couple because "OMG, a gay romance is actually happening!" rather than because the story is a well-written one involving two great fleshed out characters played by two great actors. Other than the fact that Luke & Noah are part of a gay romance, why do people like them? Beats me. I loved Luke back when he was a child. Loved the Malta storyline with Damien and loved seeing him stand up to his self-absorbed mother while she was mourning Rose's death. This current Luke is an annoying brat. I also don't think that Van Hansis is any better than the likes of other actors in his age group (ie. Jesse Soffer or Agim Kaba). The fact that he's willing to play a gay character doesn't make him a great actor, IMO. And Kevin...he's not exactly this great black-and-white character, either. Luke & Noah are about as shallow as a kiddie pool.

I mentioned in my message that the romance was already ruined by the fact that when Noah came in, viewers already knew that he would become Luke's boyfriend and therefore, the story was way too predicatable. Luke saw Noah..pretended to hate him for a few weeks and then BAM! He's suddenly into the guy. What is it about Noah, though that Luke likes so much? I think any romance should make people care or understand why feelings are there...and I'm just not seeing it in this story. Craig's obsession with Meg at this point makes much more sense.

I actually relate to Luke in a way because I know what it's like to act like a snob towards a crush (I've been like that) only to start feeling completely sorry for myself when he doesn't seem to notice me...so why is it that I don't feel that much involvement in this story? I also know what it's like not to have a really good reason as to why you feel completely infatuated with somebody but they should really address this more with Luke's character. At least find a good reason why he likes Noah..and if he doesn't, let him admit that, too!

My message wasn't this long actually. I just said I think the characters and their relationship haven't been well-established and that they need to be fleshed out. I'm really not feeling it at all right now and I think if they make changes later, it'll be too late. A good romance also requires a great beginning...and Nuke don't have that.
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Y&RWorldTurner
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Sharongate, bitches!

I COMPLETELY AGREE! The Luke and Noah relationship has been horribly written since its inception and I'm sorry, I'm not willing to overlook that. Everywhere you look, there's a plot hole in this story. I also get the feeling a lot of people like this storyline simply because it's a gay romance, regardless of how poorly written it is. It's nice to know I'm not the only one feeling this way.
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RogerNewcomb
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I love them. I think the pacing was all off because of some major casting stuff and the trip to Branson but now it's on track and I think will be great from here on out.
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psychofan
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#1 Fan of Daytime Psychos!

I couldn't disagree more. I don't think the pacing has been off at all. In fact, I think this is moving even quicker than a hetero romance.
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SpiritualJunkie


Y&RWorldTurner, glad I'm not the only one with this unfortunate frame of mind!

psychofan, do you think the fast pacing is a good thing or a bad thing?
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Y&RWorldTurner
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Sharongate, bitches!

I also think part of me had higher than average expectations for a storyline involving a romance between Luke and another man. They hyped his coming out to death and eventually fizzled out his original storyline. The least I expected of them was to create a gradual romance for Luke, in a realistic way. I especially HATED how Luke was automatically "falling in love" with Noah after like one meeting. Remember when he was telling Jade about falling for the wrong guy again, when he hadn't even really known Noah then? That's an AWFUL set-up to any kind of relationship. That alone left me cold for the remainder of Nuke's romance. Also, Noah's father's in town and he's extremely intimidated by him, yet this is the set up for the famous kiss? Again, horrible set-up, Noah being afraid of his father and the whole idea of his sexuality should be enough to prevent him crossing that boundary.

The way I would've written it, would be entirely different. I'd start Noah and Luke off as co-workers who were never originally interested in one another. Luke certainly wouldn't be "falling for the wrong guy" after one friggin' meeting! Eventually, they'd grow as friends, but Noah secretly hides his sexuality. The whole back story for Noah would be an abusive father who is extremely intolerant, and one who Noah obviously keeps his true sexuality from. Noah would feel as if he had no one to turn to, but he gets to know Luke and all the struggles Luke faced in order to come out. Soon, Noah would confide his secret to Luke and Luke would morph into his shoulder to cry on. Eventually, they'd both harbor feelings for one another, but Noah's insecurity and his father's ignorance would be the main obstacles. I wouldn't even have the Maddie debacle thrown in there, that was a horrible step.

As I've said before, Passante and her crew created a horrible set-up and follow-thought littered with horrendous plot-holes, that's just unforgivable to me. I especially hate how some are acting like this storyline is ATWT's saving grace, because it really isn't. Why are so many willing to overlook horrible writing for this storyline, yet they aren't willing to overlook the horrible writing for the rest of the storylines on this show? It really doesn't make sense to me.
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OakdaleU
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Y&RWorldTurner
Aug 17 2007, 09:45 PM
I also think part of me had higher than average expectations for a storyline involving a romance between Luke and another man. They hyped his coming out to death and eventually fizzled out his original storyline. The least I expected of them was to create a gradual romance for Luke, in a realistic way. I especially HATED how Luke was automatically "falling in love" with Noah after like one meeting. Remember when he was telling Jade about falling for the wrong guy again, when he hadn't even really known Noah then? That's an AWFUL set-up to any kind of relationship. That alone left me cold for the remainder of Nuke's romance. Also, Noah's father's is in town and he's extremely intimidated by him, yet this is the set up for the famous kiss? Again, horrible set-up, Noah being afraid of his father and the whole idea of his sexuality should be enough to prevent him crossing that boundary.

The way I would've written it, would be entirely different. I'd start Noah and Luke off as co-workers who were never originally interested in one another. Luke certainly wouldn't be "falling for the wrong guy" after one friggin' meeting! Eventually, they'd grow as friends, but Noah secretly hides his sexuality. The whole back story for Noah would be an abusive father who is extremely intolerant, and one who Noah obviously keeps his true sexuality from. Noah would feel as if he had no one to turn to, but he gets to know Luke and all the struggles Luke faced in order to come out. Soon, Noah would confide his secret to Luke and Luke would morph into his shoulder to cry on. Eventually, they'd both harbor feelings for one another, but Noah's insecurity and his father's ignorance would be the main obstacles. I wouldn't even have the Maddie debacle thrown in there, that was a horrible step.

As I've said before, Passante and her crew created a horrible set-up and a follow-thought littered with horrendous plot-holes, that's just unforgivable to me. I especially hate how some are acting like this storyline is ATWT's saving grace, because it really isn't. Why are so many willing to overlook horrible writing for this storyline, yet they aren't willing to overlook the horrible writing for the rest of the storylines on this show? It really doesn't make sense to me.

Because that's all we have left to root for. I probably would not be watching if it wasnt for Luke and Noah. And yes the writing has been bad but all of Jean's stories have. It is nothing new. <_<
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RogerNewcomb
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Some stories start off good and end bad. Other stories have a shaky start and then get good. I think this story is about to pop. We can't go back and change anything prior to now, but I think it has more buzz than any other soap story and will be fun to watch from here on out. It definitely is the main thing keeping me interested right now. I would have written it a million different ways but it is what it is. And today, I loved it.
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Y&RWorldTurner
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Sharongate, bitches!

OakdaleU
Aug 17 2007, 09:50 PM
Y&RWorldTurner
Aug 17 2007, 09:45 PM
I also think part of me had higher than average expectations for a storyline involving a romance between Luke and another man. They hyped his coming out to death and eventually fizzled out his original storyline. The least I expected of them was to create a gradual romance for Luke, in a realistic way. I especially HATED how Luke was automatically "falling in love" with Noah after like one meeting. Remember when he was telling Jade about falling for the wrong guy again, when he hadn't even really known Noah then? That's an AWFUL set-up to any kind of relationship. That alone left me cold for the remainder of Nuke's romance. Also, Noah's father's is in town and he's extremely intimidated by him, yet this is the set up for the famous kiss? Again, horrible set-up, Noah being afraid of his father and the whole idea of his sexuality should be enough to prevent him crossing that boundary.

The way I would've written it, would be entirely different. I'd start Noah and Luke off as co-workers who were never originally interested in one another. Luke certainly wouldn't be "falling for the wrong guy" after one friggin' meeting! Eventually, they'd grow as friends, but Noah secretly hides his sexuality. The whole back story for Noah would be an abusive father who is extremely intolerant, and one who Noah obviously keeps his true sexuality from. Noah would feel as if he had no one to turn to, but he gets to know Luke and all the struggles Luke faced in order to come out. Soon, Noah would confide his secret to Luke and Luke would morph into his shoulder to cry on. Eventually, they'd both harbor feelings for one another, but Noah's insecurity and his father's ignorance would be the main obstacles. I wouldn't even have the Maddie debacle thrown in there, that was a horrible step.

As I've said before, Passante and her crew created a horrible set-up and a follow-thought littered with horrendous plot-holes, that's just unforgivable to me. I especially hate how some are acting like this storyline is ATWT's saving grace, because it really isn't. Why are so many willing to overlook horrible writing for this storyline, yet they aren't willing to overlook the horrible writing for the rest of the storylines on this show? It really doesn't make sense to me.

Because that's all we have left to root for. I probably would not be watching if it wasnt for Luke and Noah. And yes the writing has been bad but all of Jean's stories have. It is nothing new. <_<

But why is this the only thing left rooting for? What separates the horrible writing in this storyline, from the horrible writing of the other storylines on ATWT? I don't get it. Also, Noah's a new character, why should I/the audience care for him?

Personally, the only bright spot I see in the show is Lucinda being used a lot more than usual. It's nice to see someone over 50 on this show, and I'm only 24. I never really got the assumption that if you're young, you'll hate older characters. TPTB really need to reevaluate their plans, because whatever they're doing isn't working.

Honestly, I'm not bashing the Nuke storyline because I want to. I'm bashing it simply because I had higher expectation for it, and so far it's been an utter flop in my eyes. The whole show is pretty much a whole flop. Just because this storyline is something different, that doesn't mean its horrible writing should be excused. I'm not trying to ignite a war here. :lol:
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OakdaleU
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Y&RWorldTurner
Aug 17 2007, 10:01 PM
OakdaleU
Aug 17 2007, 09:50 PM
Y&RWorldTurner
Aug 17 2007, 09:45 PM
I also think part of me had higher than average expectations for a storyline involving a romance between Luke and another man. They hyped his coming out to death and eventually fizzled out his original storyline. The least I expected of them was to create a gradual romance for Luke, in a realistic way. I especially HATED how Luke was automatically "falling in love" with Noah after like one meeting. Remember when he was telling Jade about falling for the wrong guy again, when he hadn't even really known Noah then? That's an AWFUL set-up to any kind of relationship. That alone left me cold for the remainder of Nuke's romance. Also, Noah's father's is in town and he's extremely intimidated by him, yet this is the set up for the famous kiss? Again, horrible set-up, Noah being afraid of his father and the whole idea of his sexuality should be enough to prevent him crossing that boundary.

The way I would've written it, would be entirely different. I'd start Noah and Luke off as co-workers who were never originally interested in one another. Luke certainly wouldn't be "falling for the wrong guy" after one friggin' meeting! Eventually, they'd grow as friends, but Noah secretly hides his sexuality. The whole back story for Noah would be an abusive father who is extremely intolerant, and one who Noah obviously keeps his true sexuality from. Noah would feel as if he had no one to turn to, but he gets to know Luke and all the struggles Luke faced in order to come out. Soon, Noah would confide his secret to Luke and Luke would morph into his shoulder to cry on. Eventually, they'd both harbor feelings for one another, but Noah's insecurity and his father's ignorance would be the main obstacles. I wouldn't even have the Maddie debacle thrown in there, that was a horrible step.

As I've said before, Passante and her crew created a horrible set-up and a follow-thought littered with horrendous plot-holes, that's just unforgivable to me. I especially hate how some are acting like this storyline is ATWT's saving grace, because it really isn't. Why are so many willing to overlook horrible writing for this storyline, yet they aren't willing to overlook the horrible writing for the rest of the storylines on this show? It really doesn't make sense to me.

Because that's all we have left to root for. I probably would not be watching if it wasnt for Luke and Noah. And yes the writing has been bad but all of Jean's stories have. It is nothing new. <_<

But why is this the only thing left rooting for? What separates the horrible writing in this storyline, from the horrible writing of the other storylines on ATWT? I don't get it. Also, Noah's a new character, why should I/the audience care for him?

Personally, the only bright spot I see in the show is Lucinda being used a lot more than usual. It's nice to see someone over 50 on this show, and I'm only 24. I never really got the assumption that if you're young, you'll hate older characters. TPTB really need to reevaluate their plans, because whatever they're doing isn't working.

Honestly, I'm not bashing the Nuke storyline because I want to. I'm bashing it simply because I had higher expectation for it, and so far it's been an utter flop in my eyes. The whole show is pretty much a whole flop. Just because this storyline is something different, that doesn't mean its horrible writing should be excused. I'm not trying to ignite a war here. :lol:

Well, I am 36 here and I love Lucinda too. But watching Meg trying to and succeding in out smarting her is stupid and absurd. I cringe at that storyline and two of my favorites are on it....Craig and Lucinda. Meg was a favorite but she has been so watered down it isnt even funny.

As for the Luke and Noah romance....well I will have to tell you by PM why I like the story even though it has it flaws. And yes both being gay does help. I wont deny that.
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Steve Frame
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The Luke/Noah storyline has many problems and because of that I can only rank it 3rd in what I like on the show.

THe Lucinda, Craig & MEg stuff is my favorite with the Lily/Holden stuff coming in 2nd. I love that they have used her more lately.

I think the biggest problem for me and I have said it before is that I was very disappointed that they went the old route of making Noah bisexual and had to have him question his being gay.

Of course that is the thing with the networks still. No one can be just gay, they have to wrestle with it, they have to have bad feelings about it, etc.

I think they honestly think that people want accept a character that is gay because he just is - he's gay. Or that he doesn't have bad feelings about being gay. And that is what makes me the most mad. I mean do straight people ever feel bad that they ahve sex with the opposite sex. No they don't. And gay people don't agonize every day of their lives about the fact that they happen to be attracted to the same sex.

It is the same assumption that they make that since they are targeting the younger viewer now - viewers don't want to see older people anymore.

I sometimes wonder how this new breed of soap producers and writers ever got to their positions. They definitely didn't do it with brains or rational thinking.

I just hope that a kiss is not all we ever see with Luke & Noah. Maybe since Passions finally broke the trend by actually letting people know that Vincent and Chad had "anal" sex then Luke & Noah can have sex. Bianca & Lena never did and Maggie & Bianca didn't either.

I am just holding out for better more interesting things with the story. Eventually the buzz that the press is giving the show and the story will die down if the writing for the story doesn't get better.

Hopefully with the additions of some great scriptwriters now changes will be made at the head too.
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SpiritualJunkie


Y&RWorldTurner...I also don't understand how the Nuke story remains so overhyped despite that it is full of flaws just like every other storyline on the show. It is getting quite a bit of buzz (for a soap story) but other than the fact that it's a gay romance, the romance itself is dead boring.

This is an extreme analogy but has anyone here ever seen the German film Nekromantik? Well, I saw the sequel. The overall idea is disgustingly fascinating (not that I'm saying homosexuality can be described the same way mind you) but the movie probably had one of the worst scripts ever made. The mediocre acting and horrible direction certainly didn't help, either. While there were some very memorable moments, the movie as a whole was extremely tedious to watch.

If I were to rewrite the Nuke story, I would have established Noah as a character first. Like Y&RWorldTurner mentioned, why should we care about a newbie? I also wouldn't have let the fans in on the fact that Noah was brought in to become Luke's boyfriend. People reacted to the Noah character the same way they reacted to Kevin. It didn't matter who Luke's boyfriend was...just as long as he had one.

Roger, you're right about stories changing for the worse and vice versa. Still, I believe that if you want a great story (like the buzz is making this Nuke story out to be), you need a strong beginning. If you have a good start, that provides opportunities in the future to go back and bring 'history' back. I can't think of too many stories which I hated originally and ended up liking later in which the characters and their relationships with each other weren't already well-established at one point.

Steve, my favourite ATWT storyline also happens to be Meg/Craig/Lucinda. Here's a story people are totally nailing to the ground yet I think there's way more potential in that story than Nuke's. Why? Because the writers have let us in on how these characters feel and have actually bothered to explore their relationships with each other. The same thing needs to be done with Luke & Noah and then maybe I'll care.
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Mr. Brightside
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My take: the storyline was too anticipated. We knew there would be NUKE even before Noah first aired. They could have easily brought him on as Maddie's new love interest and then BAM, NUKE happens.
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kserox10


ehhh.

I really do not like them.

I like the charatcers themselves but as a couple.ehh. not really
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WTGH
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Bitch!

I could take it or leave it.

The story has been featured too sporadically for me to take any interest. I think it's a given that Noah won't officially date Luke, but just use him.

Kinda like Joshua Jackson and the jock in Cruel Intentions. :huh:
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Mr. Brightside
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WTGH
Aug 19 2007, 10:36 AM
Kinda like Joshua Jackson and the jock in Cruel Intentions. :huh:

LOL I watched CR a few months ago when I was drunk...realized that the jock "Gregory" was Eric Mabius from Betty!
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RogerNewcomb
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I do not think the current incarnation of ATWT is capable of telling a great story from beginning, through middle to the end. They just haven't done it in years and years. If that's what we're judging stories on then they all have to be rated low. I'm judging this one on how much I enjoy watching and discussing it and that's more than any story in a long time.

As to knowing there would be a Nuke in advance, is there EVER a casting on any soap where we don't know who the character will hook up with in advance. This is not different in any way. Anyone who reads spoilers will always know. That's like blaming the fact that you read spoilers as the one of the reasons you didn't enjoys.

ATWT of the past few years tends to start a story well then limp to the finish line. I think this one will be the opposite, especially after they see the incredible buzz generated over the past few days.

At least if the show if off the air in a year, they can be proud they went forward with the kiss and the storyline in general.
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