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DAYS: Weekly Discussion; Week of July 14
Topic Started: Jul 14 2008, 02:34 AM (4,109 Views)
FanODays


Days4Life
Jul 15 2008, 05:52 PM
Shylock
Jul 15 2008, 05:11 PM
I wish more of an issue would be made about how detrimental Lucas is to Sami's maturity. Lucas has always been judgmental and overbearing to her, while EJ has nurtured who she is (probably because they're a lot alike). She feels she needs to comply to Lucas' wants and needs for her (be perfect, don't ever do anything wrong, and if she doesn't fit into that - then he lashes out at her and demeans her), whereas EJ just wants her to be honest with herself and do things according to how she really feels.. not doing things in accordance to how she thinks other people expect her to feel.. and how they expect her to be as a person.
Lucas has always wanted Sami to turn into a Carrie clone. He has an image of how he wants her to be, but Sami is not that person and never will be. That's why I've never seen the great Lumi love match that others see. He's always put Carrie on a pedestal and set her up as the ideal woman and expected Sami to live up to that, instead of appreciating her for herself. I hate the way he's demeaned her over the years and will probably never forgive him for flashing that enormous diamond he gave Carrie in Sami's face, knowing that the one he had given her was much smaller. IMO, that's the Lumi relationship in a nutshell--Carrie is the desired one he can't have, Sami is the leftovers he's stuck with.
Lucas did not always want Sami to be Carrie. Way back, they were the best of friends, granted they spent most of their time scheming to get Austin and Carrie but they were best friends. Then SHE betrayed HIM by lying about Will's paternity and the war started. It wasn't until Sami went through that window that Lucas and Sami started to face up to their true feelings and the differences between being in love with an idea, Austin and Carrie and truly loving someone. They accepted each other as they were. Sadly though the writers were too lame to continue with that and they started changing Lucas into Austin-lite as it was so perfectly put who put demands on Sami, something Lucas wouldn't do if he was written true to character.
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Days4Life


I liked Sami and Lucas as best friends. That's the only time I've liked them together actually. But I respectfully disagree about the Carrie issue. While Lucas may not want Carrie the person, he wants that ideal. He wants the perfect girl (not that Carrie is perfect), the good girl, the girl who always does the right things, and Sami is not that and never will be. Sami is also hung up on the illusion of the perfect life--how many times have we heard her proclaim that Lucas is the love of her life and that if only she and Lucas and their children were together, then everything in her life would be perfect? Yes, there have been brief periods of self-awareness with Lumi when they seem to actually see each other for who they are, but they are brief and it never lasts. If Lumi is the end game, however, that's what needs to happen. No more screaming at each other, no more demeaning comments, no more deceits and games and abuse....they need to see each other for who they truly are and then go from there.
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PhoenixRising05
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GET EM STEPH!!

Days4Life
Jul 16 2008, 10:31 AM
I liked Sami and Lucas as best friends. That's the only time I've liked them together actually. But I respectfully disagree about the Carrie issue. While Lucas may not want Carrie the person, he wants that ideal. He wants the perfect girl (not that Carrie is perfect), the good girl, the girl who always does the right things, and Sami is not that and never will be. Sami is also hung up on the illusion of the perfect life--how many times have we heard her proclaim that Lucas is the love of her life and that if only she and Lucas and their children were together, then everything in her life would be perfect? Yes, there have been brief periods of self-awareness with Lumi when they seem to actually see each other for who they are, but they are brief and it never lasts. If Lumi is the end game, however, that's what needs to happen. No more screaming at each other, no more demeaning comments, no more deceits and games and abuse....they need to see each other for who they truly are and then go from there.
You hit the nail right on the head. That has been true to who Lucas is since day one. From the moment he arrived, it was made apparent. He always seemed to like that "girl next door" type and that is why he wanted Carrie so bad to start. When he first met Sami, I think he saw a bit of that but once she became all about Austin, he soon became all about Carrie because he saw everything he wanted in her.

Notice how Sami and Lucas began to fall for each other...when she fell through the glass doors and was left mute. She was left in a vulnerable and innocent state. For the first time in a long time, he saw what he wanted in her. Lucas then became Austin-like, always wanting Sami to be something she could never be and that has continued to this day. It always seems to happen to every man Sami has been with, except Brandon. Brandon had a little period where he was like that but that was more because Sami hurt him. Other then that, he accepted her, faults and all. That is why I always like Brandon and Sami, no matter how bad Cedano was.

Yesterday's show was ok. The Morgan/Philip stuff dragged and only got good when Bo and Hope got involved. I agree with Jane in that they probably wanted to set up the end of the episode, which is nice because for weeks we had big things happen in the middle of the episode. I just don't want to get the sense of an episode dragging so I hope they don't make this a regular habit. It hasn't been under Higley as far as episode pace so I don't expect it. Nice to see Marianne as the post office worker. I thought Renton was good in the police station scenes. Glad this dock story is moving along and loved Philip's scene with Victor at the end. Bo and Hope being playful with each other in the beginning was cute. Loved the Ciara scenes too. Peter Reckell's eyes light up when he is around her, probably because he just had a daughter. It helps so much that this girl looks like Peter and Kristian. So cute, as was seeing Caroline interact with her. I had to laugh too when Caroline told Hope she didn't have to look far for Morgan and Hope turned around and had an "Oh shit, it's my lucky day" look on her face and then repeated that face when Bo showed up as she was going to call him. :laugh: .

Sami and EJ had good scenes. That was the most alive I've seen Ali in forever and JS was fantastic. I'm really getting into this now because it's really almost like a downfall for Sami. EJ mentioning her lie about Lucas hitting Will years ago (loved the flashback) really showed me that this story is reversing everything Sami done to others by having it being done to her. I love it. Now she is the one losing not one but two men and now perhaps her son. I really think this is more about EJ sending a message about Sami's recent actions. This is almost making up for the weeks of crap we got in May and June with this story. Almost. Liked the Susan and Edmund mention too. Surprised no one mentioned that. It was great to finally hear about her and I liked EJ mentioning how he used to party and such. We barely know much about him his history so I enjoyed that.

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Days4Life


I can't believe I forgot to mention the Edmund and Susan comment! I wasn't expecting that and it made me smile because I loved that storyline.

Loved the EJ/Sami scenes. It's always nice when we get long, extended conversations when the characters really get into the meat of the argument. Loved the flashback and how instead of being regretful about it, Sami said she'd do whatever it takes to keep her son. I think she has a worthy opponent in EJ because he's not going to let her walk all over him and he has the power to play as dirty as she does.
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PhoenixRising05
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GET EM STEPH!!

I like long, extended scenes too. Beth Milstein and Hogan gave us alot of that. It's the reason why I always advocate for small cast episodes. Gives you room for character work.

I have to say Dena and her team don't do bad with small cast episodes. Yesterday the Philip/Morgan stuff dragged at the start but I thought Sami/EJ was well-done and she's done good in the past too. I recall the episode in May where Sami told John about his past. That episode had 4 characters...Sami, John, Nicole, and EJ and it was well-done too.

I just hope we don't see a return to the flashbacks we saw last week. We have only seen one flashback this week and that was the classic Sami/Lucas one and I've noticed when we get a week or two like this the next week or so usually has a ton of flashbacks, which suggests the writers are tired or trying to regroup or something. I'm all for classic flashbacks but I don't want to see a plethora of recent ones like what happened last week.
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Mason


Days4Life
Jul 16 2008, 11:31 AM
I can't believe I forgot to mention the Edmund and Susan comment! I wasn't expecting that and it made me smile because I loved that storyline.
That was freakin' awesome! I just wish we could get a damn Kristen reference here or there like we get with Susan/Edmund.

Even though I hate the EJamicas story with a passion, I have to admit, I kind of liked E.J. and Sami's scenes yesterday. E.J. said some things that Sami really needed to hear (not that it'll make any difference, I'm sure).
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PhoenixRising05
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GET EM STEPH!!

I would like a reference too, Mason.

Somehow I doubt we will get it though. We don't even know if Stefano or anyone else knows where Kristen is. I was shocked they mentioned Susan because Hogan seemed to steer clear from mentioning her and everytime he went into EJ's backstory, it seemed to change a bit each time. That is why I liked what they mentioned yesterday with his partying because it sort of tied in with the life he led as a race-car driver and helps to explain why he can be a bit egotistical.
Edited by PhoenixRising05, Jul 16 2008, 11:45 AM.
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Pearly
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Ther Monday and Tuesday shows were great! I hope this trend continues but, of course, I'm sure that will NOT be the case. :ermm:
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Miss Rhi
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"If Sami can't find happiness with a Martian, then she can't find happiness with anyone."

PhoenixRising05
Jul 16 2008, 11:39 AM
I just hope we don't see a return to the flashbacks we saw last week. We have only seen one flashback this week and that was the classic Sami/Lucas one and I've noticed when we get a week or two like this the next week or so usually has a ton of flashbacks, which suggests the writers are tired or trying to regroup or something. I'm all for classic flashbacks but I don't want to see a plethora of recent ones like what happened last week.

I'm watching live and am 15 minutes in and there's been one flashback so far, with Phillip thinking back to the night before where he told a sleeping Victor that he may have screwed up. This one was short and worked into the story today, so it wasn't as bad as other ones have been ....

I'm glad that Days usually does the subtitles with the foreign talk, it would be nice to have that on Y&R when Morticia and Mumbler speak French to one another.... :hmmph:

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Days4Life


Bo's backing himself into quite a corner. I can understand him not wanting to upset Victor, but that's no reason to withhold evidence, especially when he knows someone else--John--has been a leading suspect in this whole dock war/Hollingsworth disappearance. He should have just avoided the whole subject--same goes for Philip, who started it all. Bo shouldn't have kept the tape out of evidence to begin with and what does he think Victor's going to do with it there in his hospital bed? I'm sure someone else will find it, although if it's Kate she'll continue to hide the tape to protect Philip.

I wasn't too interested in anything else today.
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Tripp
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Geekette

Well today's show was so boring. It was tough to pay attention.

Theo and Ciara's "playdate" pretty much told me how it's a mistake to write this story. I'm sorry, autism is a story that just doesn't play well on soaps...even with characters you might really care about. Soap kids are pretty just plot devices for action stories like kidnappings or illnesses where transplants are needed. Other times they can be used to prop another character (usually to show a former bad person being kind to a child means he/she has a heart of gold on the inside). But doing a story like this requires more than I think soaps can handle now. It takes proper setup for people to care about the characters AND their child (I don't care for the children of my favorite couples, much less Theo, son of Abe and Lexie who I wanted split years ago). It takes a sensitivity to the dialog and writing which must be reflected in everyone involved...especially the child. Up until now, we've heard Lexie and Abe go on and on about Theo, but now it's time to show us. Of course, the young boy they hired isn't ready to do such material...but it falls flat for him to talk in, say something random, they run off and then the behavior happens off camera. Audiences need to see this story play out first hand, not second hand. *sigh*

European trains are a LOT bigger than American ones aren't they?

The scenes for Stephanie seemed to all have a !!! at the end of ever line. I do like SH but I can't stand when they give her stuff like this. She comes across looking like a kid who is throwing a tantrum. "Oh no! My boyfriend left town and didn't tell me!" Yes, I realize it can be more serious than that but that's how it comes across. Watching S/K reduced to propping Stax makes me bang my head.

Love the Victor/Bo stuff though I do think they did the monitor too much. The second time Lexie ran in so fast she must have been waiting with the nurse and machine to come in. I know it's for drama, but by the THIRD time his monitor started beeping, I wondered if maybe if someone should just look at the machine. I'd die laughing though if we had old Vic under there who can will his heartbeat to slow down or speed up just to get Bo to do his bidding and protect Philip.
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Mason


Today's was boring (as usual).

I appreciate that the writers remember that at one point Max was a famous racecar driver...but really...who cares that he has papparazi on his ass?

I feel bad for Stephen and Mary Beth having to play the Greek chorus to Shelley Hennig's Stephanie. Steve and Kayla seem so isolated from everyone else now. I really wouldn't be surprised if they were gone by the end of the year. Clearly, no one has any earthly idea what to do with them.

This autism story is such a joke, it's not even funny. It's coming off more like filler than anything else. And worst of all, I'm finding myself not even caring one iota about it.
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Alligato
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I hate the autism story because 1. I can't stand child actors. 90% of them suck and come off so scripted. And don't get me started on babies. Totally distracting and the actors look so uncomfortable. 2. Okay. So Theo has autism and we saw Lexie and Abe come to terms with it. Now what? Are they going to cure it? Are we going to follow Lexie and Theo to therapy sessions and watch him progress? Are we going to keep pitying them? Is Abe and Lexie going to fight about it all of the time? That just seems too realistic for a soap that thrives on evil scientist butlers and memory holding disks.
I don't know where the story is in having a soap character have autism.

Too funny about Victor being able to control his heart monitor to get Bo to do his bidding for him! Silly silly silly!

Today wasn't the best show for me! Anything lacking John/Ava/Marlena/Nicole/Trent/EJ/Sami/Chloe/Lucas/Phillip/Morgan usually comes off as a dull show!
Stax on a Train doesn't capture my attention like it is supposed to.
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PhoenixRising05
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GET EM STEPH!!

Today was ok. Alot of filler.

The flashback with Philip and Victor was fine. I don't mind those. I enjoyed his scenes with Victor and Kate. They really built the tension well and I think Bo kept the tape from evidence because he was already conflicted about what to do. He's been conflicted during this whole investigation, wanting to believe Philip is innocent but still trying to do his job. His scenes with Victor were well-done IMO because Victor pushed the right buttons with Bo and the final push Bo needed was Victor's monitors going off. I really like this story and I like that it sets up good conflict, especially for Bo and Hope. Good ending. I also like how Peter and Lauren always keep the tension between their characters as Bo and Kate should not really like each other after everything that has happened.

I did enjoy the Hope/Abe scenes and the nice Abe/Lexie scene at the end. That was classic Days. I also did like the mini Ciara/Theo comment because that is true to the condition but I just am not feeling this story. Everytime I see it it reeks of Higley being forced to write it. There are moments where it works but you don't see it enough and you don't get to see enough of Abe and Lexie's home life to really care. They should be showing us the struggles at home and the arguments between them or even Abe yelling out Theo like he mentioned today. Instead, we get them telling others about it and a few instances here and there. Plus, everyone seems to know Theo is autistic already. I would've preferred Abe and Lexie told their friends individually over time. The scenes were nice but this story is just a bust.

I was happy they went into Max's race car past. I thought that was a nice touch. Clearly, the picture will end up showing up and Trent will see it and take off to find Max so it was nice set up. I like the way the train scenes looked though. I had no problem with the Steve, Kayla, and Stephanie scenes. Nice family scenes that went into Steve over protectiveness and his still learning to be a father while also having to let go of a daughter he never had a chance to raise. I like them always bringing up how Steve wasn't there. All three played this well and I did like Stephanie pushing for her independence. The Steve/Kayla scene at the end was sweet and, again, classic Days IMO.

Tomorrow looks like a much better show but this wasn't all that bad. We at least got plot movement.
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Days4Life


Tripp
Jul 16 2008, 03:51 PM

Theo and Ciara's "playdate" pretty much told me how it's a mistake to write this story. I'm sorry, autism is a story that just doesn't play well on soaps...even with characters you might really care about. Soap kids are pretty just plot devices for action stories like kidnappings or illnesses where transplants are needed. Other times they can be used to prop another character (usually to show a former bad person being kind to a child means he/she has a heart of gold on the inside). But doing a story like this requires more than I think soaps can handle now. It takes proper setup for people to care about the characters AND their child (I don't care for the children of my favorite couples, much less Theo, son of Abe and Lexie who I wanted split years ago). It takes a sensitivity to the dialog and writing which must be reflected in everyone involved...especially the child. Up until now, we've heard Lexie and Abe go on and on about Theo, but now it's time to show us. Of course, the young boy they hired isn't ready to do such material...but it falls flat for him to talk in, say something random, they run off and then the behavior happens off camera. Audiences need to see this story play out first hand, not second hand. *sigh*

This is exactly why I have never been even mildly interested in this storyline. Where are they going to go with it? The parts of the story that could have been used for dramatic effect, such as Lexie and Abe receiving the diagnosis from the therapist, have played out off screen. We got the scene where they told Marlena, which was pretty good, but other than that there's been nothing of interest going on. Yes, it has created some conflict for Abe and Lexie but they've had problems for years and no one really cares any more. I believe Dena said on the Today show that this was going to continue on into the fall, but I don't see how they are going to sustain it that long, unless it's just used as filler. More play dates, more boring conversations between Abe and Lexie, more monotone delivery from the child actor....boring! After seeing the Brian Williams PSA during the show, I'm becoming convinced this was mandated by NBC, like the "green" shows.
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Days4Life


Mason
Jul 16 2008, 03:57 PM


I feel bad for Stephen and Mary Beth having to play the Greek chorus to Shelley Hennig's Stephanie. Steve and Kayla seem so isolated from everyone else now. I really wouldn't be surprised if they were gone by the end of the year. Clearly, no one has any earthly idea what to do with them.

Sadly, I agree. I was so happy when Steve and Kayla came back, but most of their run this time around has been a big disappointment.
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Kevc1980
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I liked todays show..Bo and Victor's scenes were great and I'm really enjoying this Bo/Victor/Phillip story...Its about time Bo did a favor for his father, after all the favors Victor has done to Bo these past few years..And i enjoyed Kate and Phillip, mainly because lately we haven't got to see them interact as much...Also Kate is such a recognizable character that i'm happy she's being used more..

The Abe and Lexie scenes were well done..It was nice seeing Hope being a supporting character in this Autism storyline..And i liked the advice she gave Abe..I just thought these scenes were well written..The boy that plays Theo isn't the best actor, but i love the little girl that plays Ciara..

Max and the train wasn't bad and really didn't take up too much airtime..Basically just to show us he's traveling in France..The best part about those scenes is we didn't have any flashbacks..I was shocked...

Stephanie, Steve, and Kayla's scenes were boring, but i loved the Steve and Kayla scene at the end...I just really wish we get to see baby Joe...I'm tired of them just mentioning him in passing..That could have been an important story, that Dena missed out on telling..
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PhoenixRising05
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GET EM STEPH!!

Days4Life
Jul 16 2008, 04:42 PM
Tripp
Jul 16 2008, 03:51 PM

Theo and Ciara's "playdate" pretty much told me how it's a mistake to write this story. I'm sorry, autism is a story that just doesn't play well on soaps...even with characters you might really care about. Soap kids are pretty just plot devices for action stories like kidnappings or illnesses where transplants are needed. Other times they can be used to prop another character (usually to show a former bad person being kind to a child means he/she has a heart of gold on the inside). But doing a story like this requires more than I think soaps can handle now. It takes proper setup for people to care about the characters AND their child (I don't care for the children of my favorite couples, much less Theo, son of Abe and Lexie who I wanted split years ago). It takes a sensitivity to the dialog and writing which must be reflected in everyone involved...especially the child. Up until now, we've heard Lexie and Abe go on and on about Theo, but now it's time to show us. Of course, the young boy they hired isn't ready to do such material...but it falls flat for him to talk in, say something random, they run off and then the behavior happens off camera. Audiences need to see this story play out first hand, not second hand. *sigh*

This is exactly why I have never been even mildly interested in this storyline. Where are they going to go with it? The parts of the story that could have been used for dramatic effect, such as Lexie and Abe receiving the diagnosis from the therapist, have played out off screen. We got the scene where they told Marlena, which was pretty good, but other than that there's been nothing of interest going on. Yes, it has created some conflict for Abe and Lexie but they've had problems for years and no one really cares any more. I believe Dena said on the Today show that this was going to continue on into the fall, but I don't see how they are going to sustain it that long, unless it's just used as filler. More play dates, more boring conversations between Abe and Lexie, more monotone delivery from the child actor....boring! After seeing the Brian Williams PSA during the show, I'm becoming convinced this was mandated by NBC, like the "green" shows.
I still think NBC went to Corday and that they went to Higley. I also think this was done to try to make Dena appeal to the public, just like the purpose behind her blog. I've had the feeling since her blog entry on the subject she felt uncomfortable with the story, which is why the stuff like the scene where Abe and Lexie were at the doctors and the scene where they found out about Theo were not shown. They were probably taking her back to a time she didn't want to go back to. Still, she could've had someone on the team handle it but I do think it explains it. I have a feeling part of the reason NBC is keeping Days is so they can have it around to promote other NBC shows and causes.

The baby Joe story was such a missed opportunity. It seems like as soon as we hit June, they just dropped it. Dumb but they rushed Kayla's pregnancy story to the end along with the Steve/Ava arc because they wanted to keep Ava around. It sucks because Steve and Kayla, more then anyone else since their return, have been screwed over so much by transitions and direction shifts. It's the major reason why most fans who never saw them during their first run can't get around to liking them.
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IMissAremid
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After all... tomorrow is another day!

Oh I forgot to mention this about yesterday's show. I did NOT like the Susan and Edmund reference because it was another case of them rewriting EJ's history again as I believe they had previously talked about Susan being dead or at least EJ seriously hinted at that in Fall of 2006 and it just reminded me once again what a mess the writers have made of EJ's backstory from him having the never explained name of Wells, to having English nannies care for him with little involvement, to being raised by Stefano at Maison Blanche to be his soldier, oh wait no he was with Susan and Edmund and they're still alive. UGH. That's not even getting into the Oxford-educated/pro racer/mobster/barrister thing. I wish they would pick one mythology and stick to it. Because for a SORASed 10-year-old Elvis sure does seem to have had a pretty full life. It would be one thing if I thought the Susan-Edmund thing came up because Susan is going to come back or have some role in upcoming story, but it just seemed like a throwaway line. Especially since up to this point EJ's supposed whole motivation for wanting to be with Sami is his screwed up family life forcing him to want to create his own family so him having Susan and Edmund have some supportive and loving role in his life totally contradicts that.
Edited by IMissAremid, Jul 16 2008, 09:56 PM.
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PhoenixRising05
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GET EM STEPH!!

^I agree with what your saying but I think part of the reason why his history changed so much under Hogan was because of the instant redemption of last Spring and Summer. Hogan had him as a bad guy until he was pushed in another direction. Therefore, they fucked with EJ's history. As for 2006, there were 3 writers in like a 6 month span so that tends to happen.

With Higley, the history will likely stay the same since it seems she has at least a direction for EJ, as a character, to go in. I don't recall him ever mentioning Susan was dead. I think it was implied by him saying something like his mother is gone or out of his life or something (my memory is fuzzy as hell LOL) but I always assumed Stefano found him and trained him and is the one who helped push EJ away from his mother, making him into who he was when he turned up in 2006.

He may have just got in touch with Susan and Edmund and perhaps wants to go there to make amends. We really weren't given enough details so alot of it isn't clear. I do think this still fits with his screwed up family history. His mother is Susan LOL and Stefano is his father and once you get into all the details, it all meshes well.
Edited by PhoenixRising05, Jul 16 2008, 10:04 PM.
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