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| Dena Higley QUITS — SUDS REPORT EXCLUSIVE; Breaking News — TVGC; ATWT actor FIRED | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Jul 26 2008, 06:10 PM (133,359 Views) | |
| Manny | Jul 30 2008, 07:10 AM Post #2461 |
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Yeah, but still.. it was Hogan's decision as well.. :D Thanks for the extra info, though! ;) |
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| ladyofthelake | Jul 30 2008, 07:16 AM Post #2462 |
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Professor-in-training
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How do you know that? Once again, using the term "nobody" is one that insinuates everyone thinks like you. They don't. I, for one, agree with those who feel Tom's passion is a plus. There IS more to life than Marlena! And, for the umpteenth time, I will once again give high KUDOS to Tim (Phoenix) and his remarks about the problems with fanbases. Ken Corday's penchance for wanting to cater to all of them has caused a lot of problems. And, then I'll hear someone post "He didn't cater to MINE", and that will prove my point, because he tries to make them all happy. Thus, anything good for any character doesn't last long, because then he has to try to make the other side happy. I cannot lambast a writer simply because because he/she doesn't cater to my favorites. I would have quit when Marlena and Don Craig broke up. (wait, I DID! LOL. But not for that reason. Real life, no VCR, and realizing soaps are fictional did. I kept up with the newspaper, just enough). So, I would have quit when they broke up Shimi. BUT, I saw other reasons to watch. Yeah, the writing for Shelligan's Island was pretty bad, but I always managed to find something good in the show. That's part and parcel of being a general fan who realizes that I can't always get my way in life. |
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| Ridge | Jul 30 2008, 07:18 AM Post #2463 |
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Ok, try to skim through the 165 pages... So Higley is NOT and has NOT been writing DAYS? Ed Scott has? And he has given her the boot? Is that the big story? |
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| Steve Frame | Jul 30 2008, 07:23 AM Post #2464 |
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I can and I will compare any show I want to Days. The concept is still the same - just as Oz's set is not that elaborate Days sets don't have to be either if you have the right story. If what you and Jane are saying is true and the way it has to be then you might as well cancel Days now because it has no chance whatsoever if every one feels that way. Days is not going to get a butt load of money overnight to upgrade the sets, put it in High Definition and make it look like some big elaborate well produced primetime show. If that is what it has to have to survive then I say pull the plug now because there is no way in hell it is going to happen. I am sure there are some fans out there that feel that way, but I can bet you 100% that they are mostly of the younger crowd who goes from one fad to the other. Older fans in their 30's and 40's don't give a rat's ass about any of those things. We watch for the story. If they wanted all that stuff they sure in hell wouldn't watch it on a small screen on their computer or an Ipod. So I can't even say to all certaintly that all the younger viewers want what you are saying either. I think there are viewers out there that feel that way but they are not as widespread as you and Jane are saying. If it was then soaps might as well quit because they are dead - doneso - with no hope of ever coming back. And I personally don't think all of them are. I think 4 of them are beyond repair and I do think Days is one of those. Sorry but I do. There has been way too much damage done to Days in the last few years by JER, Hogan and Higley along with Corday and Scott who each share just as much of the blame as the other one does - not one of them is innocent. Along with that the die hard fanbase fans share another portion as do NBC and Sony. I think the other 3 are AMC, ATWT and GL - I think they have been hurt badly too. I think it is time for the shows to cut their losses and let the shows go out with a little touch of dignity left. |
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| ladyofthelake | Jul 30 2008, 07:24 AM Post #2465 |
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Professor-in-training
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And you base this on what? Message boards? You honestly think the Average Mrs. Joe Cool who records this show just to watch to put her feet up cares about fanbases and supercouples? I'll warrant at least 70% of the folks who watch Days don't even care about message boards. Even if this is true, what about the fanbases that aren't made up of John and Marlena fans? the Jate fanbase, small as it probably is, still exists. They're not general fans? I can't stand Marlena or old John or that couple. So, I don't warrant a mention? Yes, I like Bo and Hope and Steve and Kayla, but you know, if the writing was good, I would have survived Bo and Billie or even Steve and Billie or Steve and Ava. Oh, yeah, and if there's a couple that's not thrown together just because. What about Broe versus Phloe versus Phorgan? Two years ago, Shimi versus Shelle? Ejami versus Lumi? Where does it stop? IF your assumption is true, also, that means catering to these fractured little groups caused the true general fans to leave more and more. MAYBE that's the problem with the ratings (if those can be an accurate measurement.) But, then again,the problem with ratings is it takes into account a small percentage. SoapNet folks don't count. Non-Tivo DVR recording people like me don't count in the ratings. Regular DVR and VCR people don't count. OK, I'm getting on my tangent again. I could post a book of disagreement on this, but I'd better stop. |
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| Sindacco | Jul 30 2008, 07:25 AM Post #2466 |
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There is a big difference between writing for an entire show to write a fanfic for your favorite couple. And in fanfics you don't have to think about budget, sets and stuff like that. Also, the ones complaining the most about new characters are the supercouple fans. They also complain about new couples getting love/sex scenes when their couple don't. Of course new couple get more scenes like that, couples like J&M and Bope have had ALOT of love scenes through all these years, I think it's common sense that a new couple would get more kissing, dating and love scenes. |
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| Ponz | Jul 30 2008, 07:27 AM Post #2467 |
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And there's a Lumi fanbase who've been waiting 15 years for their couple. Writers have to make tough decisions that will enrage several fanbases. This notion that fanbases deserve "respect" merely by virtue of their existence is the very mindset responsible for the directionless, clusterfuck triangles/quads of the past two years. A writer's only obligation is to tell good story. Writing to please everyone is a recipe for pleasing no one. Edited by Ponz, Jul 30 2008, 07:28 AM.
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| ladyofthelake | Jul 30 2008, 07:27 AM Post #2468 |
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Professor-in-training
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Sindacco, I flippin' love that banner! |
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| Steve Frame | Jul 30 2008, 07:31 AM Post #2469 |
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People keep throwing up the budget - the biggest problem with all the soap opera budgets is not necessarily the amount of money they have but it is more to do with how they spend what money they have. As I have said before, they could use less writers than they do. That would save them money. They can cut back on the wardrobe. Let the actresses and actors wear outfits more than once. Do as they did in the 60's and 70's when it was reported that the costumers dressed the performers in clothes that the average housewife could afford to buy in her local stores in the mid-West. They can better use the actors and actresses they have. Instead of using someone who has a 3 day guarantee more often than they are supposed to, but that person back to what they are paying them for. Instead of paying actors for work like the vets and never using them - actually use them for what they are getting paid for. Some actors get paid for months and you don't even see them. And stop bringing in people like Shirley Jones when you can get someone cheaper and promote the story and not the hiring of an actress or actor for way more than you can actually afford. Those right there would save the shows alot of money. |
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| Kenny | Jul 30 2008, 07:35 AM Post #2470 |
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Unfortunately, that'll probably be the case. |
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| Kenny | Jul 30 2008, 07:36 AM Post #2471 |
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I think he mentioned in an interview once that Hogan's team didn't understand J&M or it took him a while to understand them or something... and with J&M fans, that's the bottom line. You don't understand J&M and you're a terrible writer, apparently, LoL. |
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| Kenny | Jul 30 2008, 07:37 AM Post #2472 |
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Gigantic lie. |
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| FanODays | Jul 30 2008, 07:42 AM Post #2473 |
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Also when a new writer comes on that often means that stories are wrapped up and in Reilly's case, seeing how he dragged everything out for so very long, that was more than welcome. If Reilly were still here, Patrick would still be lurking around, the gloved hand would still be messing up things, Mimi would still be talking to herself about telling Shawn he is Claire's father, etc. The best thing Hogan and the interium writers did was wrap it all up, hence the jump in ratings. |
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| e83talus | Jul 30 2008, 07:43 AM Post #2474 |
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The following is a quote from Tom C.'s goodbye letter to Days fans aftr he was fired in February: I could probably launch into an essay about the inner workings of a television show... the secret cabals and the backalley strike deals that were made. I could potentially try and analyze the entire situation, try and find out how a writing team that started off the year doing strong, then ended up in LAST PLACE (due to dictates from the higher-ups), then somehow managed to come back and end the year in 4th place in Households and 1st place in the 18-34 demographic were all summarily kicked out at once. But this isn't about asking those questions, or trying to analyze what happened, or why we're not going home to Days again when the strike ends. That's not why I wanted to write this. Instead, this is a sad goodbye to a town I grew up with. To Tony and Anna, characters I never dreamed would be on my screen again, much less saying the words I wrote. To LeAnn and Lauren Koslow, for letting me write the one and only Kate/Anna scene of 2007 - a story I hoped and prayed would be picked up at one point. And who knows - maybe it still will be? To Julie Pinson, who redefines supporting player, and SHOULD be a leading lady... and whom I always tried so hard to give more to. I'm sorry, Julie - you deserved better. To Bo and Hope, for letting me infuse them with a sense of humor again. and especially Kristian Alfonso, for collaborating with me on one of the most wonderful eulogies at John Black's funeral. To John and Marlena, two characters I struggled with, and were JUST figuring out and finally learning to love again weeks before the strike brought everything to a crashing halt. You taught me how to delve deeper, to see how complex you both were - and how you weren't cartoons at all, but truly detailed, layered characters. To Steve and Kayla, and especially my lovely Judi Luciano (who remembered me from when I was an INTERN at Another World nine years ago!!!), who I had the pleasure of writing for again as Adrienne - the Johnson family are personal favorites of mine. And to write Benjy's death broke my heart and brought tears to my eyes - and I wouldn't have had it any other way. To Nick and Chelsea and Max and Stephanie and Belle and Shawn - for teaching me how to write kids, how NOT to write kids, and especially to Brandon and Martha for letting me move them out of the world of "kids" and into adulthood. And to Sami, Lucas and EJ - three characters who went round and round, and always taught me something new about the power of temptation, redemption and love. End Quote. "You weren't cartoons at all." I stand by my dislike of this clown! |
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| Ridge | Jul 30 2008, 07:47 AM Post #2475 |
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No one can divulge any info on what Nelson had to scoop? |
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| Steve Frame | Jul 30 2008, 07:53 AM Post #2476 |
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for me it wasn't that Hogan and team didn't just get John & Marlena but they didn't get half the characters. There were a few characters they wrote fine but they didn't get Sami, they didn't get John & Marlena, they didn't get Lucas, they didn't get the EJ we knew and loved during the summer of 06, and on and on. So many of the characters just changed under them and got so boring. Add to that many and I mean many of the stories were boring as well. |
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| Kenny | Jul 30 2008, 07:59 AM Post #2477 |
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AMEN! There are too many fans of different couples pulling the writers in different directions, and because the writers seem to be so hellbent on taking the middle road with everything as a way of pleasing them all, the show has turned into a mediocre, directionless mess. I suppose it's like the popular saying: "You can't live 'em and you can't live without 'em." If Days didn't have its supercouple fans, the show would've been discontinued decades ago. Yet at the same time, those very fans cry that they want their couple on the frontburner and they want their couple in the spotlight. They claim that lack of their couple on the frontburner is the reason for low ratings, yet when their couple is on the frontburner and the ratings still suck, they manage some way to pass the blame off on some other couple or story. There's nothing wrong with people having favorites, and hell... if people only wanna watch the show for one couple, character or actor, then that's their prerogative. They have that right. But one can't deny that their unwillingness to accept a new direction or a story that perhaps puts their couple in the line of fire has the writers between a rock and a hard place. I suppose that's not really the fault of the fans though -- it's the fault of the writers for being too scared to go full speed ahead with their vision, regardless of the uproar it may bring. Sometimes a great story with lots of fan uproar is just what the doctor ordered for ratings, as long as it's done well and the fans get their payoff in the end. Then again, so many Days writers are incapable of telling a great story to begin with, so they're not free of blame, either. |
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| Red Mist | Jul 30 2008, 08:30 AM Post #2478 |
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hmmmmmm...AS a former Lumi I can say no one wanted lumi till about 5 yrs ago. There was no lumi fan base till Higley started to move them together...until then it was you were either a Lucas fan or a Sami...Me always a Sami. And as for the romantic side of Sami...You either cheered her with Ausdumb or jeered her, while rooting for Carrie. Sami really did not come into her own till she had a real relationship with Brandon...And I much prefered Bradon over Lucas, just like now I prefer Ej with Sami over Lucas....And alot of former Lumi fans are now Ejami fans, and they are outraged now. They have tuned out the black out and it is easy to see the imapact of both Ejamis and J&MS...Ratings were great for DAYS...Them boom...What changed? Lucas returned recreating pod Sami...Suddenly Ej is fucking Nicole...Chloe stops fucking Phillip to Fuck Lucas...Stax takes over the show...Jawn and Mar end up apart, and Jawn starts fucking AVA...Every sl was suddenly shifted...Everything built was destroyed and crumbled. BED BAD WRITING is what is tanking DAYs, but my question is....Who is doing it? Is what I am seeing Higley's mess or the work of ED and PET? |
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| FanODays | Jul 30 2008, 08:31 AM Post #2479 |
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I cannot tell you how it annoys me to hear people say that if they don't get the stories they will stop watching and then complain about the stories. I get being a fan and understand that some only watch for a couple or a character but by issuing these ultamitums they are straight jacketing the writers. I know I am guilty of wanting certain couples together, Bo and Hope and not wanting others, Sami and EJ, but at the end of the day, what I really want are good stories. Days is responsible in a big way for the supercouple frenzy because when they found out the power of it, they over did it. Now they find themselves boxed in and while I understand that they are trying to respond to the fans they made the situation so they can't really bitch about it. |
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| LorrieOw | Jul 30 2008, 08:40 AM Post #2480 |
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I agree. I am a Days fan. Could care less about super couples, as long as the story is good, that is all tha matters to me. I have my characters that I love, still love to log into Youtube and watch old clips of my fav scenes. I just want a good story though. The main reason I am so gung ho for Lucas and Chloe, is I just want to see BD get to act for once, I'm sick of the same ole crap between Lucas and Sami. I pay for my DVR every month just to record Days, only reason. I pay extra for the tier that allows me to access soapnet, just in case my DVR messes up, so I can catc h any days episode I would have missed. As long as I have a good story to watch, I'm happy. |
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