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|What Have They Done To My Bad/Sometimes Good?; Frustrated and miss the grey...|
|Tweet Topic Started: Aug 18 2008, 06:36 PM (1,103 Views)|
|Shakabigfoot||Aug 18 2008, 06:36 PM Post #1|
What has Days done with my beloved grey characters? This may not be a popular thought, but they are my thoughts.
Sami-Hogan decides to turn Sami into a "heroine". (Which I have still not bought. I feel that she has done what she WANTED to do all along, using being forced into it is her fall back excuse). Enter Higley- Now she is shrieking, weak, can not make up her mind, never plots, plans or extracts the Sami vengence. I hate it! I want the fiesty, manipulating, agressive, passionate Sami back. Growing the character up to me never ment turning her into a good girl. It ment she would get better at her plotting and more sophisticated in her approach, accepting what she truly is...the Anti-Brady. I want that Sami.
EJ- Turned from an obvious bad guy to a crazed lunitic to love struck puppy by Hogan. Enter Higlley-Now he is a yoyo of affection. He is tolorating behaviors EJ DiMera would NEVER stand for. He plays weak to new John. He is Sami's lap dog and Nicoles patsy. EJ is a character that is dark, stuck between two worlds, smart as hell and in love with a Brady. Not this wishy-washy I will take what is given to me guy that is being protrayed.
Nicole-Enter Higley-Nicole Is the worst of all. She has gone from a cold hearted bitch to a whining, crying, I am scared of a man I would normally crush or have killed, pathetic looser. She has been turned from a coniving, manipulating man eater to a weak character that can only be "saved" by a man. People are feeling sorry for Nicole now...if that doesn't show you just how much the character has been destroyed I don't know what will.
Days already has it's "good guys". The people that like the "good guys" have plenty of characters to choose from. Why are they taking the characters I love, the grey ones and turning them into...well for lack of a better statement, crap. I like, no I LOVE the trouble makers. For me, they are what makes a soap, soap-y! I like internal struggle of good and bad. I like watching a cold and manipulating character work their magic with occational bouts of kindness. I loved EJ and Sami because they are cut from the same cloth and I wanted that side of Sami to be free and loved. They would make fantastic team mates. I thought an out and out battle between Sami and Nicole would be a blast to watch. I like the characters that drive the story, not just react. Unfortunatly, IMO they have all been nutered and I for one don't like it.
My point I guess is, I don't like nor understand why the writers are wiping out the grey characters. Those that have brilliance in both their evil deeds and their acts of kindness are the ones I want to watch and love the most. Yet, these character are being wiped out or mutated. I hope to see the return of the grey character. They are sorely missed by at least one person, me. Imagine if when looking back in Days history, there was no Kristen, Vivian, Tony (who we found out was Andre at the time.) or any of the other great grey charcters we have had thoughout Days history? This is the eppidemic I fear and I am watching play out on my TV.
I want the edge brought back to my beloved grey characters. For this is the medium I love the most and find myself missing more and more.
EDT:spelling corrections and gramatical errors.
Edited by Shakabigfoot, Aug 18 2008, 06:53 PM.
|Mason||Aug 18 2008, 06:59 PM Post #2|
||IMO, DAYS hasn't really had a strong villain since Kristen left. By that time, Stefano, Vivian and even Sami had become too watered down.|
|Shakabigfoot||Aug 18 2008, 07:04 PM Post #3|
At this point Steffy is our only villian.
As far as grey characters go, I do have Phillip at least...if you can call him grey in soap terms. For me he is actually a little off white. But still a mixture of both good and bad.
|River||Aug 18 2008, 07:25 PM Post #4|
A succinct summary that echoes my sentiments. I can hardly fault the producer and actors of Days for taking a red pen to their scripts. Higley's character assasinations are multiple, but those three are among the most damaged.
|Alligato||Aug 18 2008, 09:39 PM Post #5|
Interesting post, Shaka!
I totally agree about EJ. The one thing I hope that he has going for him is that instead of being "weak" where John is concerned, he is biding his time. After Steffie left, EJ had no money (supposedly), no backing, no "evil" support group, and no ground to stand on. John easily took over, especially as EJ was trying to redeem himself in Sami's eyes by not going after the Dimera fortune for Johnny.
However, working FOR John brings EJ back into the Dimera knowledge, and maybe more able to take control of this big empire if John slips up, i.e. goes to prison for kidnapping Paul.
There is possibility there for grey EJ.
Sami is gone to me. I don't know who she is or what happened to her. I have sometimes hated Sami, but I never HATED her as a character. This summer, I couldn't stand to hear her, watch her or even attempt to listen to her. She made no sense.
The destruction of Sami has been a huge disappointment and I do miss my anti-Brady. Saint Sami of Hogan was awful too. I would like to see her scheme to get EJ/Lucas/whoever and know what she wants and gets it. It has always bothered me that she wants EJ to change who he was, but Sami has fought people all her life who have wanted her to change who she was. I doubt she has changed, but recently I don't know who she is.
Nicole has been most interesting to me. When she is mean spirited, like when she pulls out some mean digs at Sami about her weight and bratty kids, I don't enjoy her. I liked her divorce from Victor and the scenes they had, some scenes with Phillip, and a few scenes with EJ...Pookie was an interesting touch to her.
The Nicole/Trent scenes were drawn out and anticlimactic. I didn't like that she wanted EJ to save her from Trent. The Nicole who got people to electrocute Victor could have gotten rid of Trent if she wanted.
Since she has been back, she has had many layers, possibly has matured a bit, and I enjoy Ari as an actress and she has chemistry with almost any person she is opposite (Vic, Tamara, Chloe, Sami, EJ, Lucas, Phil, etc) so I think she is good for the story, but the story she is in now doesn't do her talents justice.
I don't know if shifting her into Dr. Dan's atmosphere is going to help her, but maybe it will bring a story there that she can run with.
This trio, along with Phillip/Lucas/Chloe, have such potential to be in the prime soap spot with crazy stories and crazy drama and to have a major role because I think they are all great actors, and I feel it is being wasted on petty crap.
Higley or whoever has f-ed this up royally and turned it into a circus show that people can't stand.
What can we do?
|Shakabigfoot||Aug 18 2008, 10:29 PM Post #6|
Your points about EJ make sense. Thank you, I will hold out hope that this is what has been going on.
The only saving grace the character of Sami has hope for is something to push her to return to her old self.
I find it hard to believe that Nicole is as she has been shown, UNLESS it is a set up to bring her back to her vicious ways...or that she has had something up her sleve the whole time. I loved the character of Nicole before and find her oh poor little me pill difficult to swallow.
The group "being wasted on petty crap." is a great way to say how I feel. LOL Simple and true!
I too believe that EJ/Sami/Nicole/Phillip/Chloe/Lucas (bring back Mimi, Shawn and Belle) really have so much more to offer. Especially with some being the "good guys" and some the "not so good...". They are the future of the show. I feel like they are wasting them on "petty crap" and white washing my favorite grey characters.
Edited by Shakabigfoot, Aug 18 2008, 10:30 PM.
|Shylock||Aug 19 2008, 05:10 AM Post #7|
The only GOOD thing Dena has done is give Nicole some depth to her character. I don't understand the bitching. She gets the settlement, runs into a man who actually makes her feel loved instead of using her for whatever suits their purpose (like with Trent, her father, etc) and she's older and more mature now, so she should be able to see when someone good comes along.
Do I miss her bitchyness? Yeah, but it still comes out. The only problem is her development is becoming more forced rather than gradual. Going from "Yes I want a huuuge divorce settlement and lots of money" to "Money's not all I want" shouldn't have happened as fast as it did. More being conflicted over her feelings would've been nice. She starts bordering on facing her real emotions (that the money, drinking and badness is just a cover), then she sees EJ and Sami in the thing.. and starts to revert to her old ways and maybe get swayed by either EJ, upon realizing that Nicole is better for him than Sami, or someone else on the show.
But either way, I do like that they made Nicole be a bit more multi-dimensional rather than just an evil bitch.
|Shakabigfoot||Aug 19 2008, 04:01 PM Post #8|
IMO she did have a heart before. She had one when she was with Brady. She loved him and was trying to be a better person at the same time she would do just about anything to perserve what she had with him. So for me? She was a layered character. There were different layers to her. NOW it seems that she is a weepy, weak female, the end.
I know others do like her becoming a "good" girl and feel sorry for her. I have seen it on the boards. But it seems these are the same people that love the "good guys"...which is fine. I don't begrudge anyone that. But there are some of us that like a soap for the trouble makers, the drama and the internal struggle that goes on between good and bad. I am one of those. We don't have very many characters left anymore because they are being wiped out one by one.
I agree that they moved to fast but even in moving quickly? It was not a redemption I wanted to see. I didn't want to see Sami's so called redemption either. EJ needed to be redeemed a bit because of the one note villain the character was taken to when truly the character has so much more to offer. At this point I just want them to give him back his balls.
My favorites have always been a little jaded for example:
Patch-he used to be a bad ass!
|PhoenixRising05||Aug 20 2008, 01:52 AM Post #9|
Nicole is the only grey character we have and, yes, she is a grey character. She's the one thing Higley has done right. The whole change from wanting lots of money to that not being all she wanted did not happen fast at all. I think it's always been there. Nicole came on the show a struggling waitress and then ended up in modeling where we began to see how she had aspirations to climb to the top. It was those aspirations that led to her marrying Lucas for money and giving up Eric, the guy she loved. In the end, she became a drunk as a result and was miserable. She soon got involved with Victor after Eric left town. I always saw that as her way of dealing with losing Eric. Pursuing Victor gave her a distraction and a way of getting more power and money to keep her warm at night. She did actually fall for Victor IMO because he offered her security, something that was especially needed when Paul showed up. Learning about her past, it was clear why she was the way she was.
Anyway, she was happy with Victor but then that got old and that wasn't really making her happy so she ended up having a fling with Colin that pissed off Victor and destroyed that relationship. Then, of course, we got Brady, who I think kind of reminded her of Eric in the sense that he was her only rescue from misery (with Eric, it was him saving her from a life of nothing and with Brady it was a life of misery with Victor). There was also Austin twice, who I feel also reminded her of Eric, and now we have EJ, who doesn't judge her and supports her. I think he's like Eric and Austin to her as well. I think Nicole feels that they are like kindred spirits and that is why I think she feels she has a chance with him and that is why she can show her vulnerability around him.
When she first returned, she was the same old Nicole but after EJ called her on putting up a front, she stopped doing it most of the time. He made her feel ok to show her softer side and that is why she's changed. That convinced her that love is what she wants more then anything else. I think Higley has done wonders with the character and Ari has done a fantastic job adding nuances to the role.
Having said that, the show needs more grey characters. Tony could be a great one when written that way. Philip still kind of is one. Victor is to an extent. EJ could've been a great one but they botched that. I think alot of fans don't like grey characters because they feel like they never know what the character is truly like. I disagree. I think they add variety to a canvas and keep things interesting.
|Sindacco||Aug 20 2008, 09:14 AM Post #10|
||Great post Phoenix. Finally someone besides me that understands the character of Nicole.|
|ges||Aug 20 2008, 09:42 AM Post #11|
I think Nicole has way too much air time. And don't forget that our beloved D.H. has her married to Trent. I don't care how old she was then (in college!?!) he couldn't have been any less gross than he is now. She fell in love with him. Yuck. And he blackmails her for "small favors." Very riveting Dena.
Dena just loves Nicole and wants her in every storyline. Maybe she reminds her of herself minus the glam.
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