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LATEST RATINGS: GL Hits New lows in HH/Total/Demos; Good week for ABC
Topic Started: Nov 20 2008, 05:50 PM (2,391 Views)
kserox10


Thanks to Toups

Numbers are based on Live+Same Day ratings

Ratings for the week November 10-14, 2008

(Compared to Last Week/Compared to Last Year)


Total Viewers
1. Y&R 4,876,000
2. B&B 3,481,000
3. OLTL 2,912,000
4. GH 2,889,000
5. AMC 2,683,000
6. DAYS 2,670,000
7. ATWT 2,535,000
8. GL 1,950,000 <--------------- new low



HH
1. Y&R 3.6
2. B&B 2.5
3. GH 2.2
3. OLTL 2.2
5. AMC 2.1
6. DAYS 2.0
7. ATWT 1.9
8. GL 1.4 <------------ new low



Women 18-49 Viewers




Women 18-49 Rating
1. Y&R 1.6
2. GH 1.5
2. OLTL 1.5
4. DAYS 1.3
4. AMC 1.3
6. B&B 1.2
7. ATWT 1.0
8. GL 0.7 <------------------ new low





Girls 12-17 Viewers








Women 18-34 Rating




Men 18+ Viewers



----------------------------------------

Day-To-Day Ratings - HH/Total Viewers
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ladyofthelake
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Professor-in-training

Wow, nice to see OLTL going up! I guess the stats here are showing that things pretty well stay status quo with Days, with or without J&M.
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ladyofthelake
Nov 20 2008, 05:55 PM
Wow, nice to see OLTL going up! I guess the stats here are showing that things pretty well stay status quo with Days, with or without J&M.
Lady, the news wouldn't have effected these ratings.
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Y&RWorldTurner
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Sharongate, bitches!

Glad to see Y&R and OLTL rise - the ONLY two soaps that came prepared for sweeps this year.
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PhoenixRising05
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Amello
Nov 20 2008, 05:58 PM
ladyofthelake
Nov 20 2008, 05:55 PM
Wow, nice to see OLTL going up! I guess the stats here are showing that things pretty well stay status quo with Days, with or without J&M.
Lady, the news wouldn't have effected these ratings.
It's not going to anyway, at least not until a month or so after they are officially gone. I feel that those who count in the ratings are not ones who read alot of spoilers or mags and, even if they do, they will stick around until they leave and then see what happens. Even then, I don't see it. Unless Days loses Bo and Hope too, I don't see it making much difference at all. The ratings will probably be what they've been the last year at the very least.

As hopeful and optimistic as I would like to be, GL is finished. It just keeps getting worse and all the returns in the world won't help.

Glad for OLTL. It was great and well deserved, despite my hatred for certain things. I just hope it doesn't crash next week. Big bumps like that always seem to lead to crashes, regardless of how good the following week is and OLTL IMO has been even better this week with the fallout.

Y&R IMO is he best soap right now so that is very well-deserved and AMC and GH I find have improved (AMC more then GH). I can't stand the mob stuff but it's a bit more tolerable given how we've also had Patrick/Robin and Laura/Luke/Tracy as well.

Not a bad week for soaps though. Most have either been holding their own so far or going up so that is a good sign for sweeps. I'm happy Days is holding on because this week should see an increase IMO.
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Mason


GO OLTL/Y&R!!!

So glad that the only two soaps worth watching got nice boosts.
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MaterialGurl
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Y&RWorldTurner
Nov 20 2008, 06:01 PM
Glad to see Y&R and OLTL rise - the ONLY two soaps that came prepared for sweeps this year.




IA Y&R is must see tv for me as of lately and OLTL has suprised me ;) Good for them.
Edited by MaterialGurl, Nov 20 2008, 06:18 PM.
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Ellie


PhoenixRising05
Nov 20 2008, 06:07 PM
Unless Days loses Bo and Hope too, I don't see it making much difference at all. The ratings will probably be what they've been the last year at the very least.
Disagree (surprise!) I've seen so many people join message boards in the past week to announce they're no longer watching because of this. At minimum, I think you and I can probably agree that a soap firing of this magnitude has never happened before, so there is no ratings precedent. As I wrote in another thread, a week without Marlena is completely different than Days without Deidre Hall. I think her departure will absolutely impact the ratings, and that many people watch just because she's there, not necessarily because Marlena is on on a given day. But since we're disagreeing about what might happen in the future - I guess you and I can check back with each other in six months to see who was right!
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bellcurve
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WHAT?! GL DROPPED?!

W/e, the Nielsen's are not accurate. It's the best soap on the air!

How dare soap fans watch for all those reunions and good, character driven story on Y&R?! GL hitting a series low is wrong. It's the best soap on the air.
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e83talus
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Ellie
Nov 20 2008, 06:22 PM
PhoenixRising05
Nov 20 2008, 06:07 PM
Unless Days loses Bo and Hope too, I don't see it making much difference at all. The ratings will probably be what they've been the last year at the very least.
Disagree (surprise!) I've seen so many people join message boards in the past week to announce they're no longer watching because of this. At minimum, I think you and I can probably agree that a soap firing of this magnitude has never happened before, so there is no ratings precedent. As I wrote in another thread, a week without Marlena is completely different than Days without Deidre Hall. I think her departure will absolutely impact the ratings, and that many people watch just because she's there, not necessarily because Marlena is on on a given day. But since we're disagreeing about what might happen in the future - I guess you and I can check back with each other in six months to see who was right!
I don't think it will take that long Ellie. J&M just showed back up on screen last week for two days after being off for over about a month I think. I see fans tuning in as much as they can to get the last J&M scenes (especially with all the publicity about the firing) and then once they leave in January, I see a major drop off. I think fans that have not been watching will tune back in in the coming weeks leading up to their end simply because this is it for Dee and Drake.

I know Pheonix and others don't believe ratings will be effected but that is my prediction and we will simply have to wait until February to see. I don't think we will need to wait six months though.
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Ellie


^^ Absolutely agree about a short-term bump until their last scenes, and you're making a good case for a sharp dropoff afterwards. I think it depends on how quickly the news spreads that they've been fired. At first, I thought it might spread more slowly, but it's been covered so much in the mainstream media that I think most general viewers might have an inkling of it now. If the coverage of this continues as it has, I bet there will be a ratings impact right away.
Edited by Ellie, Nov 20 2008, 07:13 PM.
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hops
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I know it will affect me, I'll be done after January lol, but I think it's a combination of the writing and the characters involved. Who knows what will happen. Fans watch soaps for all kinds of different reasons. It will be interesting at the very least.
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PhoenixRising05
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The show always gets a sizable bump into December and January anyway, regardless of who is on. People are home and colleges and schools are out. All the soaps benefit usually from around mid-December-Martin Luther King Day. Then things drop back to normal.

I understand the magnitude of the firing but you have to remember that the ratings in the past two years have hardly ever reflected reactions on message boards. The last time it really did was in winter 2007 but the show was so boring and it as very jarring for fans because all the vets were pretty much backburnered. I think the fans who count in these numbers are already used to not seeing Bo, Hope, John, and Marlena less then before. Days would've dropped below a 1.8-2.0 weeks ago if that wasn't the case because there has been far more negative reaction on boards then positive. Not to mention do you really think people that don't mind J&M leaving or like the decision are going to post? Some will but most will leave it alone and let upset fans say their peace. You can't go by internet reactions completely. You have to take into account everything.

The show, along with most soaps, is in the high 1.0's/near 2.0. Just how much further do you expect it to go when the last ten years has already seen a steady decline as far as vet usage, especially pertaining to J&M. I understand fans love J&M and see them as important. They are important but ratings are beyond the point where the loss of one couple sends them spiraling. If Bo and Hope go too or if the stories suck and are boring, then it will lose viewers. The loss of J&M alone is not enough.

J&M fans kept saying for the past two years that a good J&M story or love story would bring the ratings up. Where? I know some hate bringing up summer 2006 but it's relevant. The show was fine. In fact, it did much better and ratings actually went down upon their return. Ratings didn't respond when Sheffer gave them a wedding and mini-adventure in Italy. The ratings never responsed until the traditional holiday bump. J&M weren't even involved in the 2005 and 2006 Christmas episodes. John wasn't even present for the 2007 one and the show barely skilled a beat. The only time ratings seem to respond was John coming out of his coma (then they went right back down and you can also argue alot of stuff happened that same week as well story-wise) and the week John died (and that was a big event). The show lost nothing with Drake gone and it didn't even gain the week he returned. Other then the traditional holiday bumps, Days got nothing. The plane crash involved several major players and a major death so of course it would do well. The Olympic lead-in helped it in August along with the lockdown event. Stunts always do well usually and the ratings went right back down. Most fans, including J&M fans, were happy with the story at that time so where were the ratings increases? I saw so many J&M fans sure of themselves that fans would come back in droves. Where? I know the writing went downhill but it seems most J&M still watched anyway just to see them and the ratings still went down.

Maybe I'm wrong and I'll gladly say so if I am. Will there be a void? Sure. But there is also a void left by Martha Madison too. All I'm saying is it's easy to think a show will fall apart without your fave and that may end up being the case. However, I, personally, think the ratings are at a point now where one decision alone is not enough. A series of screwups though...definitely. The show has reason to look at the past few years and say "Hey, the numbers aren't responding well to J&M like they used to." They have a point there, whether some want to agree or not.
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hops
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PhoenixRising05
Nov 20 2008, 07:33 PM
The show always gets a sizable bump into December and January anyway, regardless of who is on. People are home and colleges and schools are out. All the soaps benefit usually from around mid-December-Martin Luther King Day. Then things drop back to normal.

I understand the magnitude of the firing but you have to remember that the ratings in the past two years have hardly ever reflected reactions on message boards. The last time it really did was in winter 2007 but the show was so boring and it as very jarring for fans because all the vets were pretty much backburnered. I think the fans who count in these numbers are already used to not seeing Bo, Hope, John, and Marlena less then before. Days would've dropped below a 1.8-2.0 weeks ago if that wasn't the case because there has been far more negative reaction on boards then positive. Not to mention do you really think people that don't mind J&M leaving or like the decision are going to post? Some will but most will leave it alone and let upset fans say their peace. You can't go by internet reactions completely. You have to take into account everything.

The show, along with most soaps, is in the high 1.0's/near 2.0. Just how much further do you expect it to go when the last ten years has already seen a steady decline as far as vet usage, especially pertaining to J&M. I understand fans love J&M and see them as important. They are important but ratings are beyond the point where the loss of one couple sends them spiraling. If Bo and Hope go too or if the stories suck and are boring, then it will lose viewers. The loss of J&M alone is not enough.

J&M fans kept saying for the past two years that a good J&M story or love story would bring the ratings up. Where? I know some hate bringing up summer 2006 but it's relevant. The show was fine. In fact, it did much better and ratings actually went down upon their return. Ratings didn't respond when Sheffer gave them a wedding and mini-adventure in Italy. The ratings never responsed until the traditional holiday bump. J&M weren't even involved in the 2005 and 2006 Christmas episodes. John wasn't even present for the 2007 one and the show barely skilled a beat. The only time ratings seem to respond was John coming out of his coma (then they went right back down and you can also argue alot of stuff happened that same week as well story-wise) and the week John died (and that was a big event). The show lost nothing with Drake gone and it didn't even gain the week he returned. Other then the traditional holiday bumps, Days got nothing. The plane crash involved several major players and a major death so of course it would do well. The Olympic lead-in helped it in August along with the lockdown event. Stunts always do well usually and the ratings went right back down. Most fans, including J&M fans, were happy with the story at that time so where were the ratings increases? I saw so many J&M fans sure of themselves that fans would come back in droves. Where? I know the writing went downhill but it seems most J&M still watched anyway just to see them and the ratings still went down.

Maybe I'm wrong and I'll gladly say so if I am. Will there be a void? Sure. But there is also a void left by Martha Madison too. All I'm saying is it's easy to think a show will fall apart without your fave and that may end up being the case. However, I, personally, think the ratings are at a point now where one decision alone is not enough. A series of screwups though...definitely. The show has reason to look at the past few years and say "Hey, the numbers aren't responding well to J&M like they used to." They have a point there, whether some want to agree or not.
Actually, lol, I know quite a few J&M fans that tuned back in Jan/Feb and then tuned out when they realized that nothing had changed. A few good weeks and then no story direction, scenes cut, stories stagnate. And yes, the Olympics gave the show a nice bump and I ya, I know some J&M fans that tuned back in, but tuned right back out when that story was dropped. And it's not just the J&M fans. Fans in general get tired of the inconsistent writing. Sometimes I've felt the writers couldn't possibly think the audience was that dumb...but then they probably really don't care. And I've always only spoken for myself. I know why I watch, other fans have different reasons. And what about when Steve/Kayla, Sami/Ej and Shelle where featured...when John was in the coma, fans didn't seem to enjoy that period very much. And Bo and Hope have never been on the back burner for more then a week at time. Sami is always featured. So there you go. You have to have the combination. For me it's John and Marlena in a good story. Others just want the over all show to be written well (I do to though). Again, it will be interesting if TPTB can find the right formula to get a new audience. And I might have to check the numbers, but Days doesn't usually do to well in December as a whole.
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e83talus
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PhoenixRising05
Nov 20 2008, 07:33 PM
The show always gets a sizable bump into December and January anyway, regardless of who is on. People are home and colleges and schools are out. All the soaps benefit usually from around mid-December-Martin Luther King Day. Then things drop back to normal.

I understand the magnitude of the firing but you have to remember that the ratings in the past two years have hardly ever reflected reactions on message boards. The last time it really did was in winter 2007 but the show was so boring and it as very jarring for fans because all the vets were pretty much backburnered. I think the fans who count in these numbers are already used to not seeing Bo, Hope, John, and Marlena less then before. Days would've dropped below a 1.8-2.0 weeks ago if that wasn't the case because there has been far more negative reaction on boards then positive. Not to mention do you really think people that don't mind J&M leaving or like the decision are going to post? Some will but most will leave it alone and let upset fans say their peace. You can't go by internet reactions completely. You have to take into account everything.

The show, along with most soaps, is in the high 1.0's/near 2.0. Just how much further do you expect it to go when the last ten years has already seen a steady decline as far as vet usage, especially pertaining to J&M. I understand fans love J&M and see them as important. They are important but ratings are beyond the point where the loss of one couple sends them spiraling. If Bo and Hope go too or if the stories suck and are boring, then it will lose viewers. The loss of J&M alone is not enough.

J&M fans kept saying for the past two years that a good J&M story or love story would bring the ratings up. Where? I know some hate bringing up summer 2006 but it's relevant. The show was fine. In fact, it did much better and ratings actually went down upon their return. Ratings didn't respond when Sheffer gave them a wedding and mini-adventure in Italy. The ratings never responsed until the traditional holiday bump. J&M weren't even involved in the 2005 and 2006 Christmas episodes. John wasn't even present for the 2007 one and the show barely skilled a beat. The only time ratings seem to respond was John coming out of his coma (then they went right back down and you can also argue alot of stuff happened that same week as well story-wise) and the week John died (and that was a big event). The show lost nothing with Drake gone and it didn't even gain the week he returned. Other then the traditional holiday bumps, Days got nothing. The plane crash involved several major players and a major death so of course it would do well. The Olympic lead-in helped it in August along with the lockdown event. Stunts always do well usually and the ratings went right back down. Most fans, including J&M fans, were happy with the story at that time so where were the ratings increases? I saw so many J&M fans sure of themselves that fans would come back in droves. Where? I know the writing went downhill but it seems most J&M still watched anyway just to see them and the ratings still went down.

Maybe I'm wrong and I'll gladly say so if I am. Will there be a void? Sure. But there is also a void left by Martha Madison too. All I'm saying is it's easy to think a show will fall apart without your fave and that may end up being the case. However, I, personally, think the ratings are at a point now where one decision alone is not enough. A series of screwups though...definitely. The show has reason to look at the past few years and say "Hey, the numbers aren't responding well to J&M like they used to." They have a point there, whether some want to agree or not.
Pheonix,

You make some valid points however you also seem to be saying that Ellie and I cannot prove or disprove our theory that ratings will increase until January and then sharply decrease after they (J&M) leave, because you and others will claim it is simply due to normal holiday ratings increases.
J&M fans will say this increase is due to J&M being reunited and fans trying to see the last dredgres of their favorite couple. People who don't like J&M will say "Days always increases because college students are home etc, etc."

So it seems that only a sharp decrease (Lets say 1.8 or below) after J&M leave would prove that J&M are still very relevant and ratings grabbers for you and others. But then again I believe the excuse will be that the writing isn't good, but I contend that the writing isn't good now, which is why in the last four weeks we have seen 2.0 and no movement whatsoever. (When J&M and Bope and S&K were fb from January to March the ratings were 2.1 to 2.3. )

By the way the ratings in the summer when many J&M fans were protesting due to Ava dropped to 1.8. We came back during the Olympics and some stayed while others have slowly dropped to only watching when the are on again. We had two weeks in September, when J&M kept mentioning divorce (we hated that) and the ratings were 1.9 and 1.8. Now J&M don't rule the world, but you would say those are anomolies while I would say J&M, Bope and S&K Fans were not pleased with the direction of the show at that time.

What I am saying is it is all subjective depending on how an individual wishes to see it. Whatever I say, you will claim a plausible alternative. Whatever you say I will claim another plausible alternative. I still say we have to wait and see! Its fun to speculate with you though!

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Ellie


Phoenix I hope you understand if I don't quote your whole post, but I will try to reply to all of your main points.

About not going by internet reactions - I agree with that, but my point is that these characters and actors are actually more popular with the 'general viewership' than they are on this board. Just anecdotally, I have heard from quite a few people who are seeing this week's SOD and are shocked that "Marlena's leaving". I think it's also safe to draw the conclusion I'm drawing based on the extensive mainstream media coverage that these firings are receving. I think that in itself is an indication of the actors' popularity.

As to how much further down do I expect the ratings to go - I'm not sure why they can't go lower than they are now. They did with Santeen, and other soaps are lower. I'm not sure I understand why you think a further decrease is impossible.

Regarding summer 2006 - I wrote this in another thread, but that was coming off of a terribly written story for J&M (Alex North), where Marlena (and John for that matter) were completely out of character. I can see why people might have needed a break from that writing! I really don't think that summer 06 is the benchmark for "Days without J&M". As for summer 07, in my mind, the excellent writing lasted all of TWO WEEKS. I just don't see how we can draw any conclusions from that. The writing went right back downhill after the Olympics.

I will, however, quote one part of your post:

Quote:
 
All I'm saying is it's easy to think a show will fall apart without your fave.
The issue here is that my "fave" is also the fave of millions of viewers. When she came back in 91, it was a media event, and her firing now seems to be a media event as well. You mentioned Martha Madison - though I love her, I don't see the comparison whatsoever. Did her firing make the New York Post the next morning? The local nightly news across the country? That's why I think this will have an impact. As someone on another board wrote, "I don't watch Deidre Hall because she's on Days. I watch Days because Deidre Hall is on." I think many, many viewers feel the same way.
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PhoenixRising05
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^Your right. The truth is the numbers can be twisted either way. I'm not saying either of us are doing that but it's true.

We'll see what happens. There really is no way of knowing. I thank you though for your respectful response. I realize my tone may have been harsh. I just got this really bad cold so watch out LOL.

It's great to discuss things with people like you, hops, and Ellie because there is always a level of respect and we can agree to disagree without anything getting out of hand. I hope you both continue to post because I enjoy these discussions and your post, even if I disagree. :smile: .
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e83talus
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PhoenixRising05
Nov 20 2008, 08:14 PM
^Your right. The truth is the numbers can be twisted either way. I'm not saying either of us are doing that but it's true.

We'll see what happens. There really is no way of knowing. I thank you though for your respectful response. I realize my tone may have been harsh. I just got this really bad cold so watch out LOL.

It's great to discuss things with people like you, hops, and Ellie because there is always a level of respect and we can agree to disagree without anything getting out of hand. I hope you both continue to post because I enjoy these discussions and your post, even if I disagree. :smile: .
Pheonix, I did not get harshness at all. I love your perspective and often just look at you and Ellie discussing different things. Sometimes blind fans can be just that Blind, and not see others points of view. I may be upset about D&D but I would in no way transfer those feelings to you.

You have been nothing but respectful even when or if we disagree.

I just think its good to have a discussion or debate without being sanctioned, deleted or banned. (I hate the SC board!)



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PhoenixRising05
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Ellie
Nov 20 2008, 08:11 PM
Phoenix I hope you understand if I don't quote your whole post, but I will try to reply to all of your main points.

About not going by internet reactions - I agree with that, but my point is that these characters and actors are actually more popular with the 'general viewership' than they are on this board. Just anecdotally, I have heard from quite a few people who are seeing this week's SOD and are shocked that "Marlena's leaving". I think it's also safe to draw the conclusion I'm drawing based on the extensive mainstream media coverage that these firings are receving. I think that in itself is an indication of the actors' popularity.

As to how much further down do I expect the ratings to go - I'm not sure why they can't go lower than they are now. They did with Santeen, and other soaps are lower. I'm not sure I understand why you think a further decrease is impossible.

Regarding summer 2006 - I wrote this in another thread, but that was coming off of a terribly written story for J&M (Alex North), where Marlena (and John for that matter) were completely out of character. I can see why people might have needed a break from that writing! I really don't think that summer 06 is the benchmark for "Days without J&M". As for summer 07, in my mind, the excellent writing lasted all of TWO WEEKS. I just don't see how we can draw any conclusions from that. The writing went right back downhill after the Olympics.

I will, however, quote one part of your post:

Quote:
 
All I'm saying is it's easy to think a show will fall apart without your fave.
The issue here is that my "fave" is also the fave of millions of viewers. When she came back in 91, it was a media event, and her firing now seems to be a media event as well. You mentioned Martha Madison - though I love her, I don't see the comparison whatsoever. Did her firing make the New York Post the next morning? The local nightly news across the country? That's why I think this will have an impact. As someone on another board wrote, "I don't watch Deidre Hall because she's on Days. I watch Days because Deidre Hall is on." I think many, many viewers feel the same way.
Ellie, I see what your saying but if you and so many others maintain you watched when Dee was on, where was the increase in ratings? That is what I'm arguing. The ratings no longer reflect the impact characters like Dee and Drake used to have. Yes, I'm sure the writing was a part of it but even with good writing, the ratings weren't maintained. Ratings don't reflect quality nor do they reflect characters anymore. I used to think they did but it has changed. The ratings are going to be what they are regardless of who is on or not. They may increase a point or two with the vets but that's it. It's not like vet-palooza last winter did much other then plane crash week. I went around the boards and most couple fans and vet fans were watching from January-April and the numbers most certainly didn't reflect that. They were pretty much the same.

Plus, all the media coverage in the world and all the complaints in the world doesn't mean people will actually tune out. I'm sure some will but it doesn't mean it will count in the ratings. I know Dee Hall is an icon but I don't think ratings fully represent her being there or not. I think more then one decision is what will produce a noticeable impact. Bad press may hurt morale and cause other issues but there is that saying...any press is good press.

As far as Dee's return in 1991, it got alot of press but that ratings bump was all but gone after a few months. I realize the writing was eh at the time but back then people had more tolerance so the fact that the ratings dropped after awhile proves it all depends on what story she is in. Right now, I think Days can at least maintain it's numbers without her and, if it produces good story, it may have a chance. I don't expect any noticeable ratings increase or decrease no matter what Days does, to be honest. I think most soaps have reached their core audience that will watch no matter what and that audience, or most of it, is probably here until the end.
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PhoenixRising05
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e83talus
Nov 20 2008, 08:19 PM
PhoenixRising05
Nov 20 2008, 08:14 PM
^Your right. The truth is the numbers can be twisted either way. I'm not saying either of us are doing that but it's true.

We'll see what happens. There really is no way of knowing. I thank you though for your respectful response. I realize my tone may have been harsh. I just got this really bad cold so watch out LOL.

It's great to discuss things with people like you, hops, and Ellie because there is always a level of respect and we can agree to disagree without anything getting out of hand. I hope you both continue to post because I enjoy these discussions and your post, even if I disagree. :smile: .
Pheonix, I did not get harshness at all. I love your perspective and often just look at you and Ellie discussing different things. Sometimes blind fans can be just that Blind, and not see others points of view. I may be upset about D&D but I would in no way transfer those feelings to you.

You have been nothing but respectful even when or if we disagree.

I just think its good to have a discussion or debate without being sanctioned, deleted or banned. (I hate the SC board!)



Exactly and thank you for that.

I love these kind of discussions. They are too rare these days. They usually end up turning too heated or getting out of line but I'm happy we can discuss this the way we are.

I think by now many of us are used to disagreeing, especially me and Ellie :laugh: .
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