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SOD: Interview with James Scott and Ari Zucker; Feb 17th issue; Article Summary
Topic Started: Feb 4 2009, 07:57 PM (21,546 Views)
SoapGal1
Member Avatar


Are we really doing this AGAIN?????

This isn't going to change ANYONE's mind on this argument. Each side sees it the way they see it. The writer's addressed it and they moved on. WE SHOULD TOO!!

Each side of this arguement sees their side and NOTHING anyone says is going to change that!!!

If you don't like EJAMI, fine, don't like them. If you do like EJAMI, fine, like them. But PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GAWD CAN WE NOT DO THIS AGAIN????

Pretty Please????
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MCKELLY


aimees76
Feb 17 2009, 11:06 AM
AidanGreensFan
Feb 16 2009, 10:31 PM
mesagirl
Feb 16 2009, 10:18 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deepDENA HIGLEY
No matter how you slice it, that scene was written as a rape.

That is what I disagree with - I don't think it was originally written to be construed as a rape at all. But their was a viewer backlash with the scene and the next thing you know 'EJ raped Sami'.

The word rape wasn't even said originally - and then a few weeks down the road it's the only word that is EVER used.

Just another example of a horribly executed story that sacrificed multiple couples and potential couples in it's long destructive path. I really believe 12/29 may go down in history as on of the WORST blunders in the history of Days if not all soaps. The far reaching effects of how completely short sighted and craptastic the writing was are astounding IMO.
I'm just jumping in right here for a second. I'm not going to get into the whole rape debate again, but I will say this, no one "caved" to the rape is not romance campaign. If they had, Sami NEVER would have gone to bed willingly with EJ in May. Prior to the campaign ever existing, spoilers indicated that EJ was going to rape Sami. The word "rape" was actually in spoilers before it ever happened on our screens or any campaign was ever organized. So I really wish that some would stop trying to villify a campaign that some felt very strongly about. The purpose of the campaign was to express a strong opposition to the romaticizing of a man who raped a woman, and the woman in question.

One more thing, when those opposed to EJ and Sami ever pairing up because of the rape (and all of the other horrendous things that he did to her and her family), several of us were accused of trying to get James fired. We were accused of wanting EJ written off and therefore wanting James to be out of a job. However, when some of us found that we could accept and even enjoy him with another female character, we are accused of being "interesting" hypocrites because we couldn't accept him with the woman he raped, but we can accept him with another woman even though "once a rapist always a rapist". :shrug:
So what I am gathering from that, is we either accept EJ with Sami, or nothing at all, otherwise we are "interesting".

I hated Jack when he raped Kayla. I never would have accepted her forgiving him and then staying in a relationship with him and continuing some preposterous "romance". I did, however, fall under the spell of Jack and Jennifer. I found myself pulled into the heart-wrenching story of a man who hated himself for the awful thing he had done, who believed himself unworthy of love, and resisted the love of a beautiful young woman who would not give up on him. Through Jennifer, Jack grew, healed, and moved forward as a character, and developed an enormous following. Clearly, some EJ fans do not want that for EJ, they want Sami or nothing at all. Which is fine, but I think accusing those fans who do genuinely appreciate his character in a different story with a different female of being false and/or hypocritical is extremely biased and unfair, not to mention wrong. And throwing around the Rape is not Romance campaign as a scapegoat for why Ejami didn't work, or why the "event" on 12/29 was called rape, is ridiculous and insulting to those of us who took that campaign very seriously, and were genuinely repulsed by the idea of a character willingly getting romantic with the man who raped her and so much more ...
As long as you are a fan of a couple because you really like them and not just because it is keeping EJ away from Lucas and Sami.

I don't like EJOLE because I am an EJAMI fan. At least I can admit it. I am not a LULOE fan though just because I want Lucas away from EJAMI. That would be hypocritical and that's the difference.

I know you are a LUMI fan so I question your real affection for EJOLE. Maybe you do like them or maybe you really like that EJ is temporarily unavailable to Sami.
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Mindy
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MCKELLY
Feb 17 2009, 11:16 AM
Mindy
Feb 17 2009, 11:04 AM
MCKELLY
Feb 17 2009, 10:16 AM
I find it interesting that the only people I know (or read on message boards about) that call it rape are those who want Sami with Lucas or EJ with Nicole. Amazing how the EJOLES don't mind the fact that EJ, the Rapist when he is with Sami, is perfect with their beloved Nicole.
Before there was even an EJole, I thought it was rape too. In fact, EJami never interested me so I didn't watch it when it happened. I do remember a friend calling me asking me if I knew that EJ had raped Sami. This friend is a general audience fan of the show who doesn't get online and ship for any particular couple. So there's a non Lumi/EJole fan example for ya. It's much harder to argue that it wasn't rape than it is to assume it was. The reason is because anytime a woman is unwillingly forced or coerced to have sex with someone, it's considered rape.

And as far as us EJOLES accepting EJ for Nicole even though he raped Sami - all I'll say is that for many people there is something twisted about a rapist and their victim falling in love. Yes, even in soapland. I personally find it quite disgusting and out of character for Sami. Also, I LOVE Jack Deveraux but I could have never accepted him and Kayla together either. I think characters who've committed vile crimes are much more redeemable when they are paired with someone other than their victims.
Here's the deal - not ALL of us believe this happened (your quote below) so not ALL of us believe it was rape.

The reason is because anytime a woman is unwillingly forced or coerced to have sex with someone, it's considered rape.

Your Jack/Kayla analogy is incorrect in my opinion as that was rape and it was HORRIBLE and VIOLENT. She had ABSOLUTELY no choice.

You could never have believed in Jack and Kayla because they never had real romance - she married him to help save his life even though she already loved Steve. He got mad when he found out a raped her.

When bonehead Lucas left Sami, she had a lovely romance with EJ that the EJAMI's will never forget and they almost made love on several occasions. Their potential as a great supercouple was always there - and obviously for myself and numerous others - continues to be.

ps. Sami had a relationship with Austin, (I believe they were engaged) years after she took advantage of him. Did that really make you sick too?
I only responded to your post because you specifically questioned how EJolers accepted EJ with Nicole even though he raped Sami. I'm not an EJami fan so clearly I don't see them the way you do. I never watched EJ and Sami prior to the rape and it totally sucks that Days chose that route and hurt their fans. But I have to view them as is and not what they could have been.

There is something disturbing to me personally when I see people comparing the "details" of two different rape incidents. I imagine that no form of rape is a good rape for the victim. Is there an actual word for what went on in that car with EJ and Sami? It can be dissected all day long. But what happened was clearly criminal and menacing. That's not necessarily the good stuff relationships are built upon.


And yeah, it did make me sick that Austin would be with Sami after what she did. It was totally unbelievable and Sami being with EJ is just as unconvincing.
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cjknick
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The bottom line is that if were rape they did a horrible job selling it ... because if it were rape IMO there should be no debate. WE all should have seen it as rape - there should be no question about it. Horribly written! doors and windows were left open ... I would love this issue to go away but whenever EJ enter's Sami orbit the word RAPE is used like a weapon. And the issue of RAPE is misused IMO.
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ilovemydays


MCKELLY
Feb 17 2009, 11:36 AM
aimees76
Feb 17 2009, 11:06 AM
AidanGreensFan
Feb 16 2009, 10:31 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deepDENA HIGLEYNo matter how you slice it, that scene was written as a rape.

That is what I disagree with - I don't think it was originally written to be construed as a rape at all. But their was a viewer backlash with the scene and the next thing you know 'EJ raped Sami'.

The word rape wasn't even said originally - and then a few weeks down the road it's the only word that is EVER used.

Just another example of a horribly executed story that sacrificed multiple couples and potential couples in it's long destructive path. I really believe 12/29 may go down in history as on of the WORST blunders in the history of Days if not all soaps. The far reaching effects of how completely short sighted and craptastic the writing was are astounding IMO.
I'm just jumping in right here for a second. I'm not going to get into the whole rape debate again, but I will say this, no one "caved" to the rape is not romance campaign. If they had, Sami NEVER would have gone to bed willingly with EJ in May. Prior to the campaign ever existing, spoilers indicated that EJ was going to rape Sami. The word "rape" was actually in spoilers before it ever happened on our screens or any campaign was ever organized. So I really wish that some would stop trying to villify a campaign that some felt very strongly about. The purpose of the campaign was to express a strong opposition to the romaticizing of a man who raped a woman, and the woman in question.

One more thing, when those opposed to EJ and Sami ever pairing up because of the rape (and all of the other horrendous things that he did to her and her family), several of us were accused of trying to get James fired. We were accused of wanting EJ written off and therefore wanting James to be out of a job. However, when some of us found that we could accept and even enjoy him with another female character, we are accused of being "interesting" hypocrites because we couldn't accept him with the woman he raped, but we can accept him with another woman even though "once a rapist always a rapist". :shrug:
So what I am gathering from that, is we either accept EJ with Sami, or nothing at all, otherwise we are "interesting".

I hated Jack when he raped Kayla. I never would have accepted her forgiving him and then staying in a relationship with him and continuing some preposterous "romance". I did, however, fall under the spell of Jack and Jennifer. I found myself pulled into the heart-wrenching story of a man who hated himself for the awful thing he had done, who believed himself unworthy of love, and resisted the love of a beautiful young woman who would not give up on him. Through Jennifer, Jack grew, healed, and moved forward as a character, and developed an enormous following. Clearly, some EJ fans do not want that for EJ, they want Sami or nothing at all. Which is fine, but I think accusing those fans who do genuinely appreciate his character in a different story with a different female of being false and/or hypocritical is extremely biased and unfair, not to mention wrong. And throwing around the Rape is not Romance campaign as a scapegoat for why Ejami didn't work, or why the "event" on 12/29 was called rape, is ridiculous and insulting to those of us who took that campaign very seriously, and were genuinely repulsed by the idea of a character willingly getting romantic with the man who raped her and so much more ...
As long as you are a fan of a couple because you really like them and not just because it is keeping EJ away from Lucas and Sami.

I don't like EJOLE because I am an EJAMI fan. At least I can admit it. I am not a LULOE fan though just because I want Lucas away from EJAMI. That would be hypocritical and that's the difference.

I know you are a LUMI fan so I question your real affection for EJOLE. Maybe you do like them or maybe you really like that EJ is temporarily unavailable to Sami.

If you are willing to admit that you don't like EJole because you want EJami I can see why you would suspect other people of being guilty of similar behavior but allow me clarify my position.

I never liked EJami. I didn't even like them before EJ raped her so her forgiving him after he apologized just annoyed me further.

I'm not a Lumi. I don't hate them but I'm not a 'fan' because I would never turn on my TV just because they were on.

I consider myself a fan of EJole and I've enjoyed all of their scenes so far but if they broke up tomorrow and Nicole moved on to Brady I'd be fine with that.
I'd feel bad for James because I think he enjoys working with Ari and I have to agree with him, Ari is the best actress on the show. Personally, I find the idea that he could be saddled acting opposite the lesser talented AS depressing but since I have no control over what the show does so C'est la vie.

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MCKELLY


Mindy
Feb 17 2009, 11:40 AM
MCKELLY
Feb 17 2009, 11:16 AM
Mindy
Feb 17 2009, 11:04 AM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deepwasn't rape than it is to assume it was. The reason is because anytime a woman is unwillingly forced or coerced to have sex with someone, it's considered rape.

And as far as us EJOLES accepting EJ for Nicole even though he raped Sami - all I'll say is that for many people there is something twisted about a rapist and their victim falling in love. Yes, even in soapland. I personally find it quite disgusting and out of character for Sami. Also, I LOVE Jack Deveraux but I could have never accepted him and Kayla together either. I think characters who've committed vile crimes are much more redeemable when they are paired with someone other than their victims.
Here's the deal - not ALL of us believe this happened (your quote below) so not ALL of us believe it was rape.

The reason is because anytime a woman is unwillingly forced or coerced to have sex with someone, it's considered rape.

Your Jack/Kayla analogy is incorrect in my opinion as that was rape and it was HORRIBLE and VIOLENT. She had ABSOLUTELY no choice.

You could never have believed in Jack and Kayla because they never had real romance - she married him to help save his life even though she already loved Steve. He got mad when he found out a raped her.

When bonehead Lucas left Sami, she had a lovely romance with EJ that the EJAMI's will never forget and they almost made love on several occasions. Their potential as a great supercouple was always there - and obviously for myself and numerous others - continues to be.

ps. Sami had a relationship with Austin, (I believe they were engaged) years after she took advantage of him. Did that really make you sick too?
I only responded to your post because you specifically questioned how EJolers accepted EJ with Nicole even though he raped Sami. I'm not an EJami fan so clearly I don't see them the way you do. I never watched EJ and Sami prior to the rape and it totally sucks that Days chose that route and hurt their fans. But I have to view them as is and not what they could have been.

There is something disturbing to me personally when I see people comparing the "details" of two different rape incidents. I imagine that no form of rape is a good rape for the victim. Is there an actual word for what went on in that car with EJ and Sami? It can be dissected all day long. But what happened was clearly criminal and menacing. That's not necessarily the good stuff relationships are built upon.


And yeah, it did make me sick that Austin would be with Sami after what she did. It was totally unbelievable and Sami being with EJ is just as unconvincing.
YOU are the one making the comparison as YOU are the one who believes both were rape. I do not and have been stating that fact in this thread all morning.


I don't think what happened that day was "clearly criminal and menacing." Slimy and inappropriate yes. EJ had a lot of growing up to do as many of our fave characters have.

Let's just agree to disagree.


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ilovemydays


cjknick
Feb 17 2009, 11:49 AM
The bottom line is that if were rape they did a horrible job selling it ... because if it were rape IMO there should be no debate. WE all should have seen it as rape - there should be no question about it. Horribly written! doors and windows were left open ... I would love this issue to go away but whenever EJ enter's Sami orbit the word RAPE is used like a weapon. And the issue of RAPE is misused IMO.
Fictional soap couples have consensual sex all of the time. Sometimes the scenes are aired and sometimes they kiss the scene goes dark but the viewers know that they had sex because we see them in bed afterward or because they talk about it or because the show refers to it.

We didn't see the entire rape scene but JS, AS and Corday call it rape and at the end of the day the show is in control and I could live without ever seeing a flashback of EJ forcing himself on Sami.

I'll just take their word for it.
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aimees76
Member Avatar


MCKELLY
Feb 17 2009, 11:36 AM
aimees76
Feb 17 2009, 11:06 AM
AidanGreensFan
Feb 16 2009, 10:31 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deepDENA HIGLEYNo matter how you slice it, that scene was written as a rape.

That is what I disagree with - I don't think it was originally written to be construed as a rape at all. But their was a viewer backlash with the scene and the next thing you know 'EJ raped Sami'.

The word rape wasn't even said originally - and then a few weeks down the road it's the only word that is EVER used.

Just another example of a horribly executed story that sacrificed multiple couples and potential couples in it's long destructive path. I really believe 12/29 may go down in history as on of the WORST blunders in the history of Days if not all soaps. The far reaching effects of how completely short sighted and craptastic the writing was are astounding IMO.
I'm just jumping in right here for a second. I'm not going to get into the whole rape debate again, but I will say this, no one "caved" to the rape is not romance campaign. If they had, Sami NEVER would have gone to bed willingly with EJ in May. Prior to the campaign ever existing, spoilers indicated that EJ was going to rape Sami. The word "rape" was actually in spoilers before it ever happened on our screens or any campaign was ever organized. So I really wish that some would stop trying to villify a campaign that some felt very strongly about. The purpose of the campaign was to express a strong opposition to the romaticizing of a man who raped a woman, and the woman in question.

One more thing, when those opposed to EJ and Sami ever pairing up because of the rape (and all of the other horrendous things that he did to her and her family), several of us were accused of trying to get James fired. We were accused of wanting EJ written off and therefore wanting James to be out of a job. However, when some of us found that we could accept and even enjoy him with another female character, we are accused of being "interesting" hypocrites because we couldn't accept him with the woman he raped, but we can accept him with another woman even though "once a rapist always a rapist". :shrug:
So what I am gathering from that, is we either accept EJ with Sami, or nothing at all, otherwise we are "interesting".

I hated Jack when he raped Kayla. I never would have accepted her forgiving him and then staying in a relationship with him and continuing some preposterous "romance". I did, however, fall under the spell of Jack and Jennifer. I found myself pulled into the heart-wrenching story of a man who hated himself for the awful thing he had done, who believed himself unworthy of love, and resisted the love of a beautiful young woman who would not give up on him. Through Jennifer, Jack grew, healed, and moved forward as a character, and developed an enormous following. Clearly, some EJ fans do not want that for EJ, they want Sami or nothing at all. Which is fine, but I think accusing those fans who do genuinely appreciate his character in a different story with a different female of being false and/or hypocritical is extremely biased and unfair, not to mention wrong. And throwing around the Rape is not Romance campaign as a scapegoat for why Ejami didn't work, or why the "event" on 12/29 was called rape, is ridiculous and insulting to those of us who took that campaign very seriously, and were genuinely repulsed by the idea of a character willingly getting romantic with the man who raped her and so much more ...
As long as you are a fan of a couple because you really like them and not just because it is keeping EJ away from Lucas and Sami.

I don't like EJOLE because I am an EJAMI fan. At least I can admit it. I am not a LULOE fan though just because I want Lucas away from EJAMI. That would be hypocritical and that's the difference.

I know you are a LUMI fan so I question your real affection for EJOLE. Maybe you do like them or maybe you really like that EJ is temporarily unavailable to Sami.
Well and that is just fine and perfectly understandable. Just like all the Luloe fans that DID show up (albeit very temporarily) the second Lucas hooked up with Chloe ... they were certainly questioned (I'm speaking of a different board, of course) and it seemed to be valid in that case since the "enthusiasm" dropped off rather quickly. However the enthusiasm for Ejole has not dropped off at all, in fact it has gained steam. There are Lumi fans, sure, that are rooting for EJole, and maybe some of them are doing it for the sake of keeping EJ away from Sami. I can only speak for myself, and I do not believe that EJ needs to be unavailable for Sami and LUcas to reunite. I do not feel threatened by EJ.

When EJ first joined the show, I was not a Lumi shipper. I enjoyed Lumi, but I was not really invested. I was open and even looking forward to, a triangle with Sami in the middle. I thought EJ would be a fabulous aside for Sami, while Lucas fumed and realized how much he loved and didn't want to lose her. I wanted to see a real love triangle develop. I liked EJ at first, even when it was revealed that he was a Dimera. I really liked the idea and possibilities it created. However, when they had EJ flip out on Sami when she chose to be with her son instead of continuing their make-out session on her couch, I started to like him a little less ... then there was when he held her by her throat against her wall and Lucas had to come in and get him off of her ... I was pretty much over that idea right about then ... then 12/29 happened .. and lest we forget, EJ didn't only do what he did in the car that night, he also SHOT and left for dead, John, Sami's stepfather. There was no going back, for me, after that night because of BOTH incidents cementing to me that EJ was a "bad guy", and there was no romance here.

As time went on and they tried to white wash the things that EJ did in an attempt to redeem him, and everyone in Salem seemed to forgive and forget, I accepted that EJ wasn't going anywhere, and yet they were not going to let him be "the next Stefano" either. This meant that I either had to accept him with Sami, which I wasn't going to, or I should hope that they find him another love interest with whom I could enjoy him. Well, obviously, they did bring on a new love interest for EJ, and I DID genuinely enjoy him with her. I never liked Nicole when she was on the show before, but I have come to love her now, and I love her and EJ together. The way I enjoy EJole is completely seperate from my feelings for LUMI, just as it has nothing to do with my feelings for my other favorite couples.

Whether EJ was in a relationship with Nicole or Kate, or Melanie, or Brady for crying out loud, does not matter to me in regards to LUMI, because I am a LUMI fan, I believe that they will reunite, and are meant for each other. I do not feel the need for the "competition" to be removed so that my couple can be together. Period.
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MCKELLY


aimees76
Feb 17 2009, 11:58 AM
MCKELLY
Feb 17 2009, 11:36 AM
aimees76
Feb 17 2009, 11:06 AM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deepDENA HIGLEYNo matter how you slice it, that scene was written as a rape.
As long as you are a fan of a couple because you really like them and not just because it is keeping EJ away from Lucas and Sami.

I don't like EJOLE because I am an EJAMI fan. At least I can admit it. I am not a LULOE fan though just because I want Lucas away from EJAMI. That would be hypocritical and that's the difference.

I know you are a LUMI fan so I question your real affection for EJOLE. Maybe you do like them or maybe you really like that EJ is temporarily unavailable to Sami.
Well and that is just fine and perfectly understandable. Just like all the Luloe fans that DID show up (albeit very temporarily) the second Lucas hooked up with Chloe ... they were certainly questioned (I'm speaking of a different board, of course) and it seemed to be valid in that case since the "enthusiasm" dropped off rather quickly. However the enthusiasm for Ejole has not dropped off at all, in fact it has gained steam. There are Lumi fans, sure, that are rooting for EJole, and maybe some of them are doing it for the sake of keeping EJ away from Sami. I can only speak for myself, and I do not believe that EJ needs to be unavailable for Sami and LUcas to reunite. I do not feel threatened by EJ.

When EJ first joined the show, I was not a Lumi shipper. I enjoyed Lumi, but I was not really invested. I was open and even looking forward to, a triangle with Sami in the middle. I thought EJ would be a fabulous aside for Sami, while Lucas fumed and realized how much he loved and didn't want to lose her. I wanted to see a real love triangle develop. I liked EJ at first, even when it was revealed that he was a Dimera. I really liked the idea and possibilities it created. However, when they had EJ flip out on Sami when she chose to be with her son instead of continuing their make-out session on her couch, I started to like him a little less ... then there was when he held her by her throat against her wall and Lucas had to come in and get him off of her ... I was pretty much over that idea right about then ... then 12/29 happened .. and lest we forget, EJ didn't only do what he did in the car that night, he also SHOT and left for dead, John, Sami's stepfather. There was no going back, for me, after that night because of BOTH incidents cementing to me that EJ was a "bad guy", and there was no romance here.

As time went on and they tried to white wash the things that EJ did in an attempt to redeem him, and everyone in Salem seemed to forgive and forget, I accepted that EJ wasn't going anywhere, and yet they were not going to let him be "the next Stefano" either. This meant that I either had to accept him with Sami, which I wasn't going to, or I should hope that they find him another love interest with whom I could enjoy him. Well, obviously, they did bring on a new love interest for EJ, and I DID genuinely enjoy him with her. I never liked Nicole when she was on the show before, but I have come to love her now, and I love her and EJ together. The way I enjoy EJole is completely seperate from my feelings for LUMI, just as it has nothing to do with my feelings for my other favorite couples.

Whether EJ was in a relationship with Nicole or Kate, or Melanie, or Brady for crying out loud, does not matter to me in regards to LUMI, because I am a LUMI fan, I believe that they will reunite, and are meant for each other. I do not feel the need for the "competition" to be removed so that my couple can be together. Period.
I can respect what you have written, though I have heard from and read threads from many LUMI fans who do not feel that way and are threatened by EJ.



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SocRMum1
Member Avatar
Much prefers sweevil, snarky EJ over Father Figure Fucktard Eejiot.

aimees76
Feb 17 2009, 11:58 AM
MCKELLY
Feb 17 2009, 11:36 AM
aimees76
Feb 17 2009, 11:06 AM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deepDENA HIGLEYNo matter how you slice it, that scene was written as a rape.
As long as you are a fan of a couple because you really like them and not just because it is keeping EJ away from Lucas and Sami.

I don't like EJOLE because I am an EJAMI fan. At least I can admit it. I am not a LULOE fan though just because I want Lucas away from EJAMI. That would be hypocritical and that's the difference.

I know you are a LUMI fan so I question your real affection for EJOLE. Maybe you do like them or maybe you really like that EJ is temporarily unavailable to Sami.
Well and that is just fine and perfectly understandable. Just like all the Luloe fans that DID show up (albeit very temporarily) the second Lucas hooked up with Chloe ... they were certainly questioned (I'm speaking of a different board, of course) and it seemed to be valid in that case since the "enthusiasm" dropped off rather quickly. However the enthusiasm for Ejole has not dropped off at all, in fact it has gained steam. There are Lumi fans, sure, that are rooting for EJole, and maybe some of them are doing it for the sake of keeping EJ away from Sami. I can only speak for myself, and I do not believe that EJ needs to be unavailable for Sami and LUcas to reunite. I do not feel threatened by EJ.

When EJ first joined the show, I was not a Lumi shipper. I enjoyed Lumi, but I was not really invested. I was open and even looking forward to, a triangle with Sami in the middle. I thought EJ would be a fabulous aside for Sami, while Lucas fumed and realized how much he loved and didn't want to lose her. I wanted to see a real love triangle develop. I liked EJ at first, even when it was revealed that he was a Dimera. I really liked the idea and possibilities it created. However, when they had EJ flip out on Sami when she chose to be with her son instead of continuing their make-out session on her couch, I started to like him a little less ... then there was when he held her by her throat against her wall and Lucas had to come in and get him off of her ... I was pretty much over that idea right about then ... then 12/29 happened .. and lest we forget, EJ didn't only do what he did in the car that night, he also SHOT and left for dead, John, Sami's stepfather. There was no going back, for me, after that night because of BOTH incidents cementing to me that EJ was a "bad guy", and there was no romance here.

As time went on and they tried to white wash the things that EJ did in an attempt to redeem him, and everyone in Salem seemed to forgive and forget, I accepted that EJ wasn't going anywhere, and yet they were not going to let him be "the next Stefano" either. This meant that I either had to accept him with Sami, which I wasn't going to, or I should hope that they find him another love interest with whom I could enjoy him. Well, obviously, they did bring on a new love interest for EJ, and I DID genuinely enjoy him with her. I never liked Nicole when she was on the show before, but I have come to love her now, and I love her and EJ together. The way I enjoy EJole is completely seperate from my feelings for LUMI, just as it has nothing to do with my feelings for my other favorite couples.

Whether EJ was in a relationship with Nicole or Kate, or Melanie, or Brady for crying out loud, does not matter to me in regards to LUMI, because I am a LUMI fan, I believe that they will reunite, and are meant for each other. I do not feel the need for the "competition" to be removed so that my couple can be together. Period.
:wow: I just wanted to jump in and say that I appreciate such a well thought and honest post. I'm a staunch EJami fan but I have to tell you it was refreshing to read your point of view.
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cjknick
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ilovemydays
Feb 17 2009, 11:57 AM
cjknick
Feb 17 2009, 11:49 AM
The bottom line is that if were rape they did a horrible job selling it ... because if it were rape IMO there should be no debate. WE all should have seen it as rape - there should be no question about it. Horribly written! doors and windows were left open ... I would love this issue to go away but whenever EJ enter's Sami orbit the word RAPE is used like a weapon. And the issue of RAPE is misused IMO.
Fictional soap couples have consensual sex all of the time. Sometimes the scenes are aired and sometimes they kiss the scene goes dark but the viewers know that they had sex because we see them in bed afterward or because they talk about it or because the show refers to it.

We didn't see the entire rape scene but JS, AS and Corday call it rape and at the end of the day the show is in control and I could live without ever seeing a flashback of EJ forcing himself on Sami.

I'll just take their word for it.
That's not what I meant .... why did Sami not report it? Why did Sami lie about helping Lucas alone? Why did Sami go to EJ's apartment Alone after it happened? What was the "MORE" that happened? Why did Sami say "It wasn't like that"? Why did Sami continue to seek EJ out? Why did she stop from killing him in that cabin? Why did she kiss him, hold his hand and say that she wanted him? Why did she say they could be friends? why did she chose to be in his life? Why did she say I need EJ? Why did her family (including Lucas) think that she had feeling and yes was even in love with EJ? Why did she allow Johnny to be in his life? Why did she make love to him? Why did she have feelings for him at all? Why did Sami never act like a rape victim EVER!!! The reason is that Sami wanted EJ - She didn't want to want him but she couldn't help it - the heart wants what the heart wants. It was easy for Sami to say it was rape or suggest it was rape then to admit to her family and even to herself that she fell in love with the enemy! So she went into denial and even in her self denial her true feelings keep bubbling out ...
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AidanGreensFan


aimees76
Feb 17 2009, 11:06 AM
AidanGreensFan
Feb 16 2009, 10:31 PM
mesagirl
Feb 16 2009, 10:18 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deepDENA HIGLEY
No matter how you slice it, that scene was written as a rape.

That is what I disagree with - I don't think it was originally written to be construed as a rape at all. But their was a viewer backlash with the scene and the next thing you know 'EJ raped Sami'.

The word rape wasn't even said originally - and then a few weeks down the road it's the only word that is EVER used.


Quote:
 
I'm just jumping in right here for a second. I'm not going to get into the whole rape debate again, but I will say this, no one "caved" to the rape is not romance campaign. If they had, Sami NEVER would have gone to bed willingly with EJ in May. Prior to the campaign ever existing, spoilers indicated that EJ was going to rape Sami. The word "rape" was actually in spoilers before it ever happened on our screens or any campaign was ever organized. So I really wish that some would stop trying to villify a campaign that some felt very strongly about. The purpose of the campaign was to express a strong opposition to the romaticizing of a man who raped a woman, and the woman in question.

One more thing, when those opposed to EJ and Sami ever pairing up because of the rape (and all of the other horrendous things that he did to her and her family), several of us were accused of trying to get James fired. We were accused of wanting EJ written off and therefore wanting James to be out of a job. However, when some of us found that we could accept and even enjoy him with another female character, we are accused of being "interesting" hypocrites because we couldn't accept him with the woman he raped, but we can accept him with another woman even though "once a rapist always a rapist". :shrug:
So what I am gathering from that, is we either accept EJ with Sami, or nothing at all, otherwise we are "interesting".


This seems to be directed at my posts so I will respond in kind.

I am not in any way 'vilifying' the RINR campaign. I think it was very effective. I think many viewers believed it was rape and expressed their feelings through the campaign and I do believe the campaign affected the story.

I do not believe it was rape and never did but that is MY opinion (as well as the opinion of others). I still believe a very effective campaign contributed to storyline direction. If there were spoilers PRIOR to the events of 12/29 I have no memory of ever seeing them. I'd love to know where they were published because again I can no believe the lack of media attention such a devastating story should generate. In fact I can't remember a single rape on daytime that wasn't covered extensively.

I do find it interesting that viewers are ok with EJ (if they believe he raped Sami) without undergoing any extensive therapy or self examination, recriminations etc.. I watched Jack Deveraux go into therapy, saw his ghost daddies mess with his head, saw him turn away Jennifer again and again. I saw him unable to be in the same room with Kayla and do whatever he could to somehow atone for what he did. EJ did none of this. So yes - I do find it interesting that a character capable of rape in your opinion, is worthy of being shipped in another relationship without any of this type of work.

FYI - I no longer give a rats ass about Ejami or any other couple on Days - as it is now the suckiest of all crapfests on Daytime.

I'm a former Ejami fan, former Days fan and am just stating my opinion. I'm not here with any axe to grind against Ejole or Lumi. I liked Lumi. Ejole is a snorefest of major proportions and why I finally tuned out. Just because someone disagrees with a point of view doesn't mean they are out to smear an entire fanbase. At least not in my world.
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ilovemydays


cjknick
Feb 17 2009, 12:19 PM
ilovemydays
Feb 17 2009, 11:57 AM
cjknick
Feb 17 2009, 11:49 AM
The bottom line is that if were rape they did a horrible job selling it ... because if it were rape IMO there should be no debate. WE all should have seen it as rape - there should be no question about it. Horribly written! doors and windows were left open ... I would love this issue to go away but whenever EJ enter's Sami orbit the word RAPE is used like a weapon. And the issue of RAPE is misused IMO.
Fictional soap couples have consensual sex all of the time. Sometimes the scenes are aired and sometimes they kiss the scene goes dark but the viewers know that they had sex because we see them in bed afterward or because they talk about it or because the show refers to it.

We didn't see the entire rape scene but JS, AS and Corday call it rape and at the end of the day the show is in control and I could live without ever seeing a flashback of EJ forcing himself on Sami.

I'll just take their word for it.
That's not what I meant .... why did Sami not report it? Why did Sami lie about helping Lucas alone? Why did Sami go to EJ's apartment Alone after it happened? What was the "MORE" that happened? Why did Sami say "It wasn't like that"? Why did Sami continue to seek EJ out? Why did she stop from killing him in that cabin? Why did she kiss him, hold his hand and say that she wanted him? Why did she say they could be friends? why did she chose to be in his life? Why did she say I need EJ? Why did her family (including Lucas) think that she had feeling and yes was even in love with EJ? Why did she allow Johnny to be in his life? Why did she make love to him? Why did she have feelings for him at all? Why did Sami never act like a rape victim EVER!!! The reason is that Sami wanted EJ - She didn't want to want him but she couldn't help it - the heart wants what the heart wants. It was easy for Sami to say it was rape or suggest it was rape then to admit to her family and even to herself that she fell in love with the enemy! So she went into denial and even in her self denial her true feelings keep bubbling out ...
Seriously! Why did she?
I believe that EJ raped Sami so many of the things Sami did after her rape made me sick.
She didn't tell everyone what EJ did because he threatened her, because she was basking in the glow of everyone thinking she was a HERO. She forgave EJ because she identified with his crime. She acknowledged that she too had crossed the line and raped Austin years ago.

The thing is none of that made me sympathize with Sami. It just made me hate the character and EJami more.


The interview in the original post captures why I like EJole. The actors just click and because of their hard work the EJole scenes are not limited by the writing. James and Ari work together to create magic and I'm glad that TPTB have noticed.






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aimees76
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MCKELLY - Thank you for respecting my POV.I am sure that you have read threads from other LUMIs who feel threatened, just as I have read threads from Ejamis who were threatened first by Lucas, and now Nicole. We are not all the same, in each fan base, we all have our own reasons for liking or disliking what we do.

SocRMum1 - Thank You. :)

cjknick - Your post was not directed at me, but IMO, laziness, bad writing, poor planning, and allowing themselves to be swayed this way and that by BOTH fan bases is to blame for the holes and directionless confusion in that story.

AidanGreensFan - I was not implying that you were smearing an entire fan base. I have read multiple posts lately, not just from you, stating that TPTB "caved" to the RINR campaign and thus called it rape. IMO, this is simply untrue. I wish that I could find the spoilers, but I know that when I was posting on NBC board, it was discussed at length, in anticipation of the rape ... there was a spoiler that EJ was to rape Sami ... then Ali went on talk shows and spoke about how "this guy raped her" .... the day it happened, one of Sami's lines in the car was "so you are going to rape me?" ... very shortly after it happened, Celeste was the first to tell Sami, "he raped you!" .. this was all before, or very early into the RINR campaign. It is my belief that TPTB had intended from the getgo to make it a rape, but due to the popularity of JS, decided to gray it up a bit in order to keep him around, and keep the Ejami fan base alive, thus fanning the flames of the fan base war between the Ejamis and the Lumis.

To answer your question about accepting EJ without any real redemption, no, I do not. What I accept is that we have a really shitty head writer who cannot write depth and characterization to save her life. What I accept is that hoping for any true, deep, story of redemption, a la Jack Deveraux, is too much to ask of the current PTB. Do I think what has been put on my screen is adequate? Hell no. Do I know that I am not going to get any better, so I might as well enjoy what I can or shut off the t.v.? Yes.
So there it is.
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AidanGreensFan


If anything this latest go round has only proven how polarizing that episode was and continues to be.

The fact we're all still posting about what did or did not happen over 2 years ago is pretty amazing and displays how deeply viewers feel about it.

Bah to the horrible writers and producers of this show that mangled it so badly.
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MCKELLY


Yet we all keep watching.

Why???????????????????????????? :drunk:
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ilovemydays



I'm watching because I like EJole! :rockon:
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MCKELLY


ilovemydays
Feb 17 2009, 03:35 PM
I'm watching because I like EJole! :rockon:
We know...we know... :puke:


Just kidding ;)

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aimees76
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LMAO!!
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daisy132


I'm an Ejami fan because this couple is magical. That stupid night was bad writing, period, and I honestly don't think the writers knew at the time how much of a following they had, or continue to have.

About rape. Since everyone is sticking to the "morality" issue, lets not forget that pretty much everything on a soap is immoral. Sleeping together without being married, having affairs, getting married and divorced every year, lying, sheaming, deceiving .... and the list goes on.

Giving someone a choice is not rape. Forcing oneself on another is. If "giving in" is rape, or "saying no" alone is rape, then women are being raped all the time -BY THEIR HUSBANDS, and boyfriends. I know I've said no many times, didn't want to, but "gave in", so I guess I'm a rape victim myself.

Seriously, this is a soap. Thing happen that don't in real life. If we choose to watch it with all the immorality, then we should just accept a writing mistake when we see one. The writers tried to fix it in May, and honestly, I don't think they're done with this issue.
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