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DAYS:Spoilers for wk of June 8th; *UPDATED 6/7*
Topic Started: May 26 2009, 10:37 PM (11,988 Views)
Manda1


laptop
Jun 8 2009, 10:09 AM
i just read an insight on this sl on another persons blog and i was so taken by the insight..this sl is risky due to all the characters having done flawed things..from ej and his wangsta lifestyle, to nicole and her baby swap and willingness to let stephanie suffer from her hubbys misdeeds, to rafe sneaking in to keep ej from his baby..finally to sami who swapped the truth for a chance at another fantasy life..

but of all of these people, only sami is going to take it on the chin, and not apologize or hide anymore. she wants her punishment, while the others are still going to hide and sneak and lie.
I think Sami wanting 'punishment' is not commendable at all what is she 6 years old? And who is without sin may I ask to mete out the punishment...I hope you don't mean she deserves what she gets from the 'He who needs life in prision and punishment for his wicked deeds against innocent people completed in the last 8 weeks' EJ?

What Sami did may not have been 'right' but she had pure motives in my opinion. She didn't want Grace raised the way she has to raise Johnny with EJ.

What kind of punsihment should be meted out to a mother who has done nothing but try to protect her child? What punishment is fitting? Did she abuse Grace? Give her cigarette burns? Lock her in a dark room to ensure she was hidden from EJ? She was not cruel to Grace at all so in my opinion there is not one person with the right to try and punish her for doing what she thought was the best thing for Grace.

Be mad, be annoyed but punish her? I think that's a riddiculous idea. [Now please I am not saying you are riddiculous but I think the idea of Sami wanting punishment as a good thing is. The others are only sneaking and lying to protect Sami who IMO needs protecting right now. She's been punished enough by Grace's death she doesn't need anything else added to that devastation and heartache. :shame:
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MrsDimera


Manda1
Jun 8 2009, 12:34 PM
laptop
Jun 8 2009, 10:09 AM
i just read an insight on this sl on another persons blog and i was so taken by the insight..this sl is risky due to all the characters having done flawed things..from ej and his wangsta lifestyle, to nicole and her baby swap and willingness to let stephanie suffer from her hubbys misdeeds, to rafe sneaking in to keep ej from his baby..finally to sami who swapped the truth for a chance at another fantasy life..

but of all of these people, only sami is going to take it on the chin, and not apologize or hide anymore. she wants her punishment, while the others are still going to hide and sneak and lie.
I think Sami wanting 'punishment' is not commendable at all what is she 6 years old? And who is without sin may I ask to mete out the punishment...I hope you don't mean she deserves what she gets from the 'He who needs life in prision and punishment for his wicked deeds against innocent people completed in the last 8 weeks' EJ?

What Sami did may not have been 'right' but she had pure motives in my opinion. She didn't want Grace raised the way she has to raise Johnny with EJ.

What kind of punsihment should be meted out to a mother who has done nothing but try to protect her child? What punishment is fitting? Did she abuse Grace? Give her cigarette burns? Lock her in a dark room to ensure she was hidden from EJ? She was not cruel to Grace at all so in my opinion there is not one person with the right to try and punish her for doing what she thought was the best thing for Grace.

Be mad, be annoyed but punish her? I think that's a riddiculous idea. [Now please I am not saying you are riddiculous but I think the idea of Sami wanting punishment as a good thing is. The others are only sneaking and lying to protect Sami who IMO needs protecting right now. She's been punished enough by Grace's death she doesn't need anything else added to that devastation and heartache. :shame:
I agree with you, however, letting another man adopt your child without the real father knowing is what I'm stuck on. Sami should have just left well enough alone and kept dating Rafe, let him move in, or even marrying him. But she should have NOT allow him to proceed with the adoption. So in my eyes EJ has a right to be pissed off and to punish her for letting another man (esp. the one he hates) proceed to adopt the "baby" he didn't know he had.
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Deleted User
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LOL, it's me being quoted.

But just to clarify, here's what I meant. I said that I thought that for the first time in a long time, Days is taking a risk with a storyline (just like I'm risking posting my "thoughts" here LOL! What is life without a risk, eh?). Killing off Grace isn't the risk, but it's the personalities involved and the "crimes" that they've committed that is the risky part. Not one of the major players in this story is innocent or pure in his/her actions. How do you root for baby thievery? How to do root for another man to step in an adopt another man's child? How do you root for a woman allowing a man to grieve a child that wasn't his or not allowing him to grieve a child that was lost? How do you root for a woman allowing another man to take a father's place and then not telling the man until after the fact that his child has died? It's hard for me to root for anyone -- and that's precisely why I'm starting to like this story. It's not an easy road for the show to take. One of my complaints about the show over the years is that they always take the easy road out, the path of least resistance. And it made it so incredibly tedious for me to watch because I knew, based on the fact that Days wouldn't do anything to rock the boat, that ultimately I'd be disappointed by the lack of drama. But this, I'm shocked. I really am and I looking forward to seeing how this is handled.

In any case, EJ, surprisingly, is the lone character who didn't play a part in the deception, although his actions in his own life, becoming Stefano obedient son, did help things along. But I was thinking about: Nicole, Sami, Rafe -- every single one of them has done wrong. Sami's motives may have been pure at first, but once she crossed the line into allowing another man to adopt EJ's baby and then not telling EJ until after his baby was gone that she was his -- I can't justify it even though Sami is a favorite character of mine. Nicole, she may have been motivated by her love for EJ at first, but now she sits in a church crying, begging to be punished but not willing to tell the truth for fear of losing everything. But still, they are playing the sympathy heavily with Nicole, in that she suffering a lot of guilt. That's OK, BTW, that's her character. Rafe to a much lesser extent because he basically was stealing another man's child, forging documents to get custody of Grace and Sami basically smiling about without any thought of possible consequences because she'll now have her dream life with her dream man. EJ, if he hadn't chosen to live a gangster life, Sami probably wouldn't have kept Grace's paternity a secret from him.

The punishment part. I don't think a character deserves punishment. What I was saying is that out of all of the characters, Sami's is the sole character that can take the hit of telling the truth. In the SOD interview, Ali Sweeney did mention that Sami wants to be punished and she knows that by telling the truth, EJ will indeed punish her. The question for me is why does she do this? I'm still not clear on that. In any case, the audience is used to Sami getting caught. Regardless of her intent, because of Grace's death she has decided to face up to the consequences. I have a suspicion that Ali won't play it for sympathy. I think Sami probably will be harsh when she blurts out the whole truth to EJ. I could be wrong about that though since they are being extra tight lipped with this spoiler. Sami is about to take it on the chin and the process may not come out smelling like a rose. What I was saying is that Nicole's character couldn't survive that kind of scene or writing. That's not saying the Ari wouldn't act it to the hilt, but as a character, Nicole's has to have a sympathetic edge or else she'd be toast because she doesn't not have the history of Sami. We expect Sami to get caught, to say awful things, to hurt people, especially those that she loves. But she manages to survive as a character.

Hopefully that makes sense and doesn't offend. And sorry for the long post.
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SocRMum1
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Much prefers sweevil, snarky EJ over Father Figure Fucktard Eejiot.

miou07
Jun 8 2009, 01:27 PM
LOL, it's me being quoted.

But just to clarify, here's what I meant. I said that I thought that for the first time in a long time, Days is taking a risk with a storyline (just like I'm risking posting my "thoughts" here LOL! What is life without a risk, eh?). Killing off Grace isn't the risk, but it's the personalities involved and the "crimes" that they've committed that is the risky part. Not one of the major players in this story is innocent or pure in his/her actions. How do you root for baby thievery? How to do root for another man to step in an adopt another man's child? How do you root for a woman allowing a man to grieve a child that wasn't his or not allowing him to grieve a child that was lost? How do you root for a woman allowing another man to take a father's place and then not telling the man until after the fact that his child has died? It's hard for me to root for anyone -- and that's precisely why I'm starting to like this story. It's not an easy road for the show to take. One of my complaints about the show over the years is that they always take the easy road out, the path of least resistance. And it made it so incredibly tedious for me to watch because I knew, based on the fact that Days wouldn't do anything to rock the boat, that ultimately I'd be disappointed by the lack of drama. But this, I'm shocked. I really am and I looking forward to seeing how this is handled.

In any case, EJ, surprisingly, is the lone character who didn't play a part in the deception, although his actions in his own life, becoming Stefano obedient son, did help things along. But I was thinking about: Nicole, Sami, Rafe -- every single one of them has done wrong. Sami's motives may have been pure at first, but once she crossed the line into allowing another man to adopt EJ's baby and then not telling EJ until after his baby was gone that she was his -- I can't justify it even though Sami is a favorite character of mine. Nicole, she may have been motivated by her love for EJ at first, but now she sits in a church crying, begging to be punished but not willing to tell the truth for fear of losing everything. But still, they are playing the sympathy heavily with Nicole, in that she suffering a lot of guilt. That's OK, BTW, that's her character. Rafe to a much lesser extent because he basically was stealing another man's child, forging documents to get custody of Grace and Sami basically smiling about without any thought of possible consequences because she'll now have her dream life with her dream man. EJ, if he hadn't chosen to live a gangster life, Sami probably wouldn't have kept Grace's paternity a secret from him.

The punishment part. I don't think a character deserves punishment. What I was saying is that out of all of the characters, Sami's is the sole character that can take the hit of telling the truth. In the SOD interview, Ali Sweeney did mention that Sami wants to be punished and she knows that by telling the truth, EJ will indeed punish her. The question for me is why does she do this? I'm still not clear on that. In any case, the audience is used to Sami getting caught. Regardless of her intent, because of Grace's death she has decided to face up to the consequences. I have a suspicion that Ali won't play it for sympathy. I think Sami probably will be harsh when she blurts out the whole truth to EJ. I could be wrong about that though since they are being extra tight lipped with this spoiler. Sami is about to take it on the chin and the process may not come out smelling like a rose. What I was saying is that Nicole's character couldn't survive that kind of scene or writing. That's not saying the Ari wouldn't act it to the hilt, but as a character, Nicole's has to have a sympathetic edge or else she'd be toast because she doesn't not have the history of Sami. We expect Sami to get caught, to say awful things, to hurt people, especially those that she loves. But she manages to survive as a character.

Hopefully that makes sense and doesn't offend. And sorry for the long post.
Great post!

You make a really solid point about the fact that Sami, as a character, is almost expected to find herself in situations like this. Not only is she about to face the wrath of EJ - but we know that Will is harsh towards her and I suspect many of her family will express their disappointment, as well. Once again, Sami has screwed up royally and will likely be the talk of the town.

I am very curious to see how they play everyone else toward EJ in this story. Will the Bradys show him any sympathy? Will they applaud Sami for trying to protect her daughter from those dastardly DiMera's? Or will they simply try to stay out of the line of fire?

As for Nicole - again, I couldn't agree more. If they don't give Nicole every sympathetic beat they can find in this story starting ASAP it will be nearly impossible to write any sort of redemption for her once the truth comes out. Depending on how the spoiler plays about Nicole betraying EJ to help Sami that could wind up being a stroke of genious. It's something I would never have expected, and if it's show that she's doing it purely out of compassion for Sami (mixed with guilt) I will be impressed. However, if it plays out as another manipulation to keep her secret then it will be stained, and won't have nearly the impact it could.

As for Rafe...that dude just really needs to go away and find himself a family. Of his own. They can portray him as being as supportive and sympathetic toward Sami as all get out - but the fact that he was all over getting those adoption papers filed like a fat kid on a Smartie the moment Sami said yes just screams all kinds of weird and creepy to me. Again - I'll have to see how the confrontation at the funeral home plays out with EJ, and later with EJ and Sami, to decide for certain what I think - but at this point I just don't see what they can do to make me feel he has more than a passing role in this story from here on out.
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Manda1


miou07
Jun 8 2009, 01:27 PM
LOL, it's me being quoted.

But just to clarify, here's what I meant. I said that I thought that for the first time in a long time, Days is taking a risk with a storyline (just like I'm risking posting my "thoughts" here LOL! What is life without a risk, eh?). Killing off Grace isn't the risk, but it's the personalities involved and the "crimes" that they've committed that is the risky part. Not one of the major players in this story is innocent or pure in his/her actions. How do you root for baby thievery? How to do root for another man to step in an adopt another man's child? How do you root for a woman allowing a man to grieve a child that wasn't his or not allowing him to grieve a child that was lost? How do you root for a woman allowing another man to take a father's place and then not telling the man until after the fact that his child has died? It's hard for me to root for anyone -- and that's precisely why I'm starting to like this story. It's not an easy road for the show to take. One of my complaints about the show over the years is that they always take the easy road out, the path of least resistance. And it made it so incredibly tedious for me to watch because I knew, based on the fact that Days wouldn't do anything to rock the boat, that ultimately I'd be disappointed by the lack of drama. But this, I'm shocked. I really am and I looking forward to seeing how this is handled.

In any case, EJ, surprisingly, is the lone character who didn't play a part in the deception, although his actions in his own life, becoming Stefano obedient son, did help things along. But I was thinking about: Nicole, Sami, Rafe -- every single one of them has done wrong. Sami's motives may have been pure at first, but once she crossed the line into allowing another man to adopt EJ's baby and then not telling EJ until after his baby was gone that she was his -- I can't justify it even though Sami is a favorite character of mine. Nicole, she may have been motivated by her love for EJ at first, but now she sits in a church crying, begging to be punished but not willing to tell the truth for fear of losing everything. But still, they are playing the sympathy heavily with Nicole, in that she suffering a lot of guilt. That's OK, BTW, that's her character. Rafe to a much lesser extent because he basically was stealing another man's child, forging documents to get custody of Grace and Sami basically smiling about without any thought of possible consequences because she'll now have her dream life with her dream man. EJ, if he hadn't chosen to live a gangster life, Sami probably wouldn't have kept Grace's paternity a secret from him.

The punishment part. I don't think a character deserves punishment. What I was saying is that out of all of the characters, Sami's is the sole character that can take the hit of telling the truth. In the SOD interview, Ali Sweeney did mention that Sami wants to be punished and she knows that by telling the truth, EJ will indeed punish her. The question for me is why does she do this? I'm still not clear on that. In any case, the audience is used to Sami getting caught. Regardless of her intent, because of Grace's death she has decided to face up to the consequences. I have a suspicion that Ali won't play it for sympathy. I think Sami probably will be harsh when she blurts out the whole truth to EJ. I could be wrong about that though since they are being extra tight lipped with this spoiler. Sami is about to take it on the chin and the process may not come out smelling like a rose. What I was saying is that Nicole's character couldn't survive that kind of scene or writing. That's not saying the Ari wouldn't act it to the hilt, but as a character, Nicole's has to have a sympathetic edge or else she'd be toast because she doesn't not have the history of Sami. We expect Sami to get caught, to say awful things, to hurt people, especially those that she loves. But she manages to survive as a character.

Hopefully that makes sense and doesn't offend. And sorry for the long post.
I think you post has some very good points. In my post I am not rooting for Sami. I am just disagreeing that she should be punsihed for doing what she think is best for her child based on the experience of what she has had to live through with the first child with this man.

She was not trying to be cruel to Grace but protect her. So whilst not hiding her paternity from the biological father would have been the right thing to do. Sami didn't hide Grace's paternity to punish EJ [he was never to find out] or be evil to Grace. Sami meant well but did the wrong thing to achieve it.

What Nicole did was not right either, but worse. She knew that Sami was coming back for her baby because she overheard the conversation at the clinic between Sami and Sis Theresa. If Sami had planned to leave Syndey at the clinic for strangers to come and adopt I would be rooting for Nicole because I would say Sami didn't want the baby anyway so Nicole might as well bring her to EJ to raise. Nicole stole Sami's baby to palm her off as her own, so she wouldn't have to risk EJ calling off the wedding when he found out their baby died. She wants EJs money and the Dimera luxury and Sami would sacrifice it all for a quite and safe exsitence with her kids. Two completely different motivations - but none of the actions are right not Sami's and not Nicole's. Should Nicole be punished? I think she should give Sydney back to Sami which is going to be punishment enough. She loves that baby and 'is' her mother now, she was grieving at the time and a bit crazy when she took her, she should be let off the hook too. Now EJ has no such excuse for the hit on Philip, the beating of Brady and kidnap of Stephanie not even in the same ball park as Sami and Nicole's 'crimes'. JMO
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Alligato
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SocRMum1
Jun 8 2009, 11:15 AM
I happen to think I'll be able to like Nicole again once this story wraps. I won't want her to be with EJ or within a country mile of Sydney - but I would root for her down the road in a different pairing if the fallout from this shows her losing everything and having to build herself up again from scratch.

I never understood how some people say that don't like EJ with Sami after what he did to her, but will like him in another pairing with someone else. How can you want someone to perpetuate their evil on other people?
Kind of similar with Nicole. She seems like she will always be a liar...unless they totally whitewash her character...which is no fun.

So are we hoping for another person to come along and make them want to be a better person?
Is that why I would want Nicole to be with Brady? He seems like a really nice guy so why would I want Nicole to come along and screw him up and break his heart? Do I think she will change if she is with him?

Or is that why people like EJ with Nicole? If EJ is a bad seed, is it okay to have him with another bad seed?
Are these rhetorical questions?? :)

I must say that I chuckle a bit when I read people talk about how Nicole will never be redeemed...or her path of redemption. I don't think it matters. People in Salem seem to have a short memory (Nicole/Chloe friendship proves this), and whether or not Nicole's intentions are honorable when she helps Sami, she will be redeemed anyways. Hell, Sami has never been redeemed for ANYTHING, but we seem to take to her okay. At least EJ made a promise to God in a church right before he went out and broke it. ;)
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mirabella


laptop
Jun 8 2009, 10:09 AM
i just read an insight on this sl on another persons blog and i was so taken by the insight..this sl is risky due to all the characters having done flawed things..from ej and his wangsta lifestyle, to nicole and her baby swap and willingness to let stephanie suffer from her hubbys misdeeds, to rafe sneaking in to keep ej from his baby..finally to sami who swapped the truth for a chance at another fantasy life..

but of all of these people, only sami is going to take it on the chin, and not apologize or hide anymore. she wants her punishment, while the others are still going to hide and sneak and lie.
How is Rafe going to hide and sneak and lie? The only lie he was hiding was that Grace was really Sami's and once Sami tells Ej, he will no longer be hiding that.
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Liz<3Days
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LOL, it's me being quoted.


What Nicole did was not right either, but worse. She knew that Sami was coming back for her baby because she overheard the conversation at the clinic between Sami and Sis Theresa. If Sami had planned to leave Syndey at the clinic for strangers to come and adopt I would be rooting for Nicole because I would say Sami didn't want the baby anyway so Nicole might as well bring her to EJ to raise. Nicole stole Sami's baby to palm her off as her own, so she wouldn't have to risk EJ calling off the wedding when he found out their baby died. She wants EJs money and the Dimera luxury and Sami would sacrifice it all for a quite and safe exsitence with her kids. Two completely different motivations - but none of the actions are right not Sami's and not Nicole's. Should Nicole be punished? I think she should give Sydney back to Sami which is going to be punishment enough. She loves that baby and 'is' her mother now, she was grieving at the time and a bit crazy when she took her, she should be let off the hook too. Now EJ has no such excuse for the hit on Philip, the beating of Brady and kidnap of Stephanie not even in the same ball park as Sami and Nicole's 'crimes'. JMO

I disagree with this part of your post.
If you watched Nicole and EJ from the beginning, it was always clear that Nicole wanted to love EJ and give him the family that they both wanted. EJ fell in love with her because she accepted him as is, she accepted his family and never had make up excuses or feel bad because he's a DiMera. Nicole fell in love with EJ because he didnt judge her either and always told her the truth- bad or good.
When she lost her baby, it was never about getting the DiMera fortune. EJ and Nicole had numerous conversations about it. This is also why EJ told Steffy that he wouldnt make her sign a Pre-nup. She also told him she'll sign one because she loves him. The only times where money was mentioned was when she said that her baby would be given all the DiMera luxuries and she pushed EJ for some trust fund so that she can get the money that doc Baker wanted for the adoption.

As for Sami's motivations, sorry but they have been selfish from the start. Th sole reason she went into WPP was to hide her pregnancy. She even told Lucas that when her dad mentioned WPP. People tend to forget her initial motives.
Then she claimed that she was only afraid of Steffy and not EJ. That he was a good father and wished she could get him out of his family's life. I can see why she would want to do that, but I dont understand why EJ's past crimes are swept under the rug, especially towards her and her family.
Finally, I recall a scene where Sami was talking to Grace and practically giddy because EJ would never know the truth. Now, please, now can Sami actions ever be considered "pure."
Liz

Edited by Liz<3Days, Jun 8 2009, 03:32 PM.
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MrsDimera


IMO, As I recall the only reason Nicole fell for EJ was because EJ was Sami's at the time. EJ only hooked up with her to make Sami jealous. It was only after Sami went into the WPP and Nicole being pregnant that he finally fell in love with her. It was because he wanted a family and he thought Nicole was preggers and Sami would never be purely his that he even proposed to her. Nicole on the other hand has a thing for men with money with the exception of Eric. When she met EJ, he was a charming, handsome, rich lawyer and married to Sami.
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Manda1


Liz<3Days
Jun 8 2009, 03:29 PM
Quote:
 
LOL, it's me being quoted.


What Nicole did was not right either, but worse. She knew that Sami was coming back for her baby because she overheard the conversation at the clinic between Sami and Sis Theresa. If Sami had planned to leave Syndey at the clinic for strangers to come and adopt I would be rooting for Nicole because I would say Sami didn't want the baby anyway so Nicole might as well bring her to EJ to raise. Nicole stole Sami's baby to palm her off as her own, so she wouldn't have to risk EJ calling off the wedding when he found out their baby died. She wants EJs money and the Dimera luxury and Sami would sacrifice it all for a quite and safe exsitence with her kids. Two completely different motivations - but none of the actions are right not Sami's and not Nicole's. Should Nicole be punished? I think she should give Sydney back to Sami which is going to be punishment enough. She loves that baby and 'is' her mother now, she was grieving at the time and a bit crazy when she took her, she should be let off the hook too. Now EJ has no such excuse for the hit on Philip, the beating of Brady and kidnap of Stephanie not even in the same ball park as Sami and Nicole's 'crimes'. JMO

I disagree with this part of your post.
If you watched Nicole and EJ from the beginning, it was always clear that Nicole wanted to love EJ and give him the family that they both wanted. EJ fell in love with her because she accepted him as is, she accepted his family and never had make up excuses or feel bad because he's a DiMera. Nicole fell in love with EJ because he didnt judge her either and always told her the truth- bad or good.
When she lost her baby, it was never about getting the DiMera fortune. EJ and Nicole had numerous conversations about it. This is also why EJ told Steffy that he wouldnt make her sign a Pre-nup. She also told him she'll sign one because she loves him. The only times where money was mentioned was when she said that her baby would be given all the DiMera luxuries and she pushed EJ for some trust fund so that she can get the money that doc Baker wanted for the adoption.

As for Sami's motivations, sorry but they have been selfish from the start. Th sole reason she went into WPP was to hide her pregnancy. She even told Lucas that when her dad mentioned WPP. People tend to forget her initial motives.
Then she claimed that she was only afraid of Steffy and not EJ. That he was a good father and wished she could get him out of his family's life. I can see why she would want to do that, but I dont understand why EJ's past crimes are swept under the rug, especially towards her and her family.
Finally, I recall a scene where Sami was talking to Grace and practically giddy because EJ would never know the truth. Now, please, now can Sami actions ever be considered "pure."
Liz

I am fully aware of how much Nicole loved EJ from the start I was very pro Ejole from the begining and still think they make a good match. I remain with my opinion that Sami motivation was for Sydney to not have to spend half her time at the Dimansion within Stephano's influence remember this is a Grandpa thak took Johonny to the grave yard as well as repeatedly tried to destroy Sami's family. EJ was never to know about Grace and was therefore never going to be hurt by Sami - And as for WP there was a killer after her that is why she was in witness protection - I know she stopped resisting when she realised she could use it to hide her preganancy but she did not set up the opportunity. This is my opinion based on what I've seen on screen.

Back to Nicole it was EJ who had to talk her into the relationship at the begining but when she lost the baby that was the time to trust in their love enough to tell the truth and move on hopefully with EJ. Nicole loves EJ but she also loves his money and status = EJ knows it and used to say things like where is my mercenery Nicole when she would be too sappy with him and I thought that was really cute about them - but she took it too far when she had to have Sami's baby - she had Mia's but it just wasn't enough.....
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Liz<3Days
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Manda1
Jun 8 2009, 03:44 PM
Liz<3Days
Jun 8 2009, 03:29 PM
Quote:
 
LOL, it's me being quoted.


What Nicole did was not right either, but worse. She knew that Sami was coming back for her baby because she overheard the conversation at the clinic between Sami and Sis Theresa. If Sami had planned to leave Syndey at the clinic for strangers to come and adopt I would be rooting for Nicole because I would say Sami didn't want the baby anyway so Nicole might as well bring her to EJ to raise. Nicole stole Sami's baby to palm her off as her own, so she wouldn't have to risk EJ calling off the wedding when he found out their baby died. She wants EJs money and the Dimera luxury and Sami would sacrifice it all for a quite and safe exsitence with her kids. Two completely different motivations - but none of the actions are right not Sami's and not Nicole's. Should Nicole be punished? I think she should give Sydney back to Sami which is going to be punishment enough. She loves that baby and 'is' her mother now, she was grieving at the time and a bit crazy when she took her, she should be let off the hook too. Now EJ has no such excuse for the hit on Philip, the beating of Brady and kidnap of Stephanie not even in the same ball park as Sami and Nicole's 'crimes'. JMO

I disagree with this part of your post.
If you watched Nicole and EJ from the beginning, it was always clear that Nicole wanted to love EJ and give him the family that they both wanted. EJ fell in love with her because she accepted him as is, she accepted his family and never had make up excuses or feel bad because he's a DiMera. Nicole fell in love with EJ because he didnt judge her either and always told her the truth- bad or good.
When she lost her baby, it was never about getting the DiMera fortune. EJ and Nicole had numerous conversations about it. This is also why EJ told Steffy that he wouldnt make her sign a Pre-nup. She also told him she'll sign one because she loves him. The only times where money was mentioned was when she said that her baby would be given all the DiMera luxuries and she pushed EJ for some trust fund so that she can get the money that doc Baker wanted for the adoption.

As for Sami's motivations, sorry but they have been selfish from the start. Th sole reason she went into WPP was to hide her pregnancy. She even told Lucas that when her dad mentioned WPP. People tend to forget her initial motives.
Then she claimed that she was only afraid of Steffy and not EJ. That he was a good father and wished she could get him out of his family's life. I can see why she would want to do that, but I dont understand why EJ's past crimes are swept under the rug, especially towards her and her family.
Finally, I recall a scene where Sami was talking to Grace and practically giddy because EJ would never know the truth. Now, please, now can Sami actions ever be considered "pure."
Liz

I am fully aware of how much Nicole loved EJ from the start I was very pro Ejole from the begining and still think they make a good match. I remain with my opinion that Sami motivation was for Sydney to not have to spend half her time at the Dimansion within Stephano's influence remember this is a Grandpa thak took Johonny to the grave yard as well as repeatedly tried to destroy Sami's family. EJ was never to know about Grace and was therefore never going to be hurt by Sami - And as for WP there was a killer after her that is why she was in witness protection - I know she stopped resisting when she realised she could use it to hide her preganancy but she did not set up the opportunity. This is my opinion based on what I've seen on screen.

Back to Nicole it was EJ who had to talk her into the relationship at the begining but when she lost the baby that was the time to trust in their love enough to tell the truth and move on hopefully with EJ. Nicole loves EJ but she also loves his money and status = EJ knows it and used to say things like where is my mercenery Nicole when she would be too sappy with him and I thought that was really cute about them - but she took it too far when she had to have Sami's baby - she had Mia's but it just wasn't enough.....
Well, we are going to see things differently because of our biases. I admit in giving Nicole "the benefit of the doubt." While others will never give her that, which is everyone's choice.

I agree, Nicole should have trusted in EJ's love and never have gone through her deceptions but I cant change that part. And as someone else stated, EJ didnt proclaim his love until after she decided to deceive him.

Sure Nicole would always want a comfortable lifestyle, but this was not her primary motivation. Just like I dont believe it was ever her intention to start a relationship with EJ solely to make Sami jealous. Nicole always questioned EJ about his feelings for Sami and he always admitted that he was not in love with Sami, but that she's Johnny's mom and will be a part of his life.

As for Mia's baby, the reason she took Sydney instead of Grace was because it was EJ's baby TOO and he would of NEVER known and raised Sydney if she didnt make that choice. It was always her intent to keep Mia's baby and pass it off as their baby. When EJ's and Sami's baby were there in the same room, that's where her intentions shifted from that of bringing a baby to EJ to that of bringing HIS BIOLOGICAL BABY.

I don't condone her actions, merely explaining them as how I see it.
Liz

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Frankly, Nicole can't "trust" in EJ's love as long as he is still tripping over himself to get to Sami. I'd always loved EJ/Nicole together. But, to me he is not a man who's head over heels in love with his wife. As long as he's seeing Sami in his dreams, I don't think that Nicole can ever "trust" in EJ's love. He is saying the words but sometimes his actions speak a whole different language. He has to do something extremely drastic to show that Nicole is his one and only. I haven't seen it yet.
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