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Spoilers for wk of December 28th; *UPDATED 12/25*
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Topic Started: Dec 16 2009, 09:56 PM (18,436 Views)
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lazydazes
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Dec 28 2009, 04:33 PM
Post #121
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Poor Sydney. One day with EJ/Sami and she has already became a bargaining chip. It's ridiculous that Sydney is being swapped around like a ragdoll while her happiness/welfare is contingent upon what man Sami chooses. Isn't the child the most important thing in this whole crazy situation? For months, there has been a mad push for Sami to get her baby back even though she lied about the child in the beginning. Of course, that was justified, at least a little while ago. Now, since Sami isn't gungho over EJ, the sentiment is that she shouldn't get her baby back. Color me confused. :shrug: I just don't get it.
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SocRMum1
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Dec 28 2009, 05:12 PM
Post #122
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Much prefers sweevil, snarky EJ over Father Figure Fucktard Eejiot.
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- magicsteacher
- Dec 28 2009, 04:25 PM
- michelle
- Dec 28 2009, 02:35 PM
- SocRMum1
- Dec 26 2009, 11:06 PM
- magicsteacher
- Dec 26 2009, 04:59 PM
Quoting limited to 4 levels deepAnd not to mention he stops worrying about his daughter enough to do a little drug dealing.
Thus far I haven't seen anything to indicate EJ is or has been doing anything to try to reconcile with Sami. Nothing. However, after listening to her spew that hypocritical crap to Rafe during the vigil about how it could have been so perfect for them if Nicole hadn't switched the babies - and Rafe responding that he'll 'raise Sydney as if she were my own' I wouldn't blame EJ one tiny bit if he wants to keep Rafe away from his kids...and Sami, too, for that matter. So if EJ is involved with the Sydnapping I sincerely doubt at this point it would be to win Sami back as much I think it would be to pay her back. And given the current writing, I'm fine with that.
Amen! You make many excellent points (as always)! I felt so badly for EJ when I had to listen to Sami and Rafe at the vigil discuss raising Sydney behind his back. Could they be any more insensitive? I hope EJ kidnaps Syd from Anna and keeps those two in the dark. It would be exactly what they deserve. What a couple of aholes.
I realize it's a soap, but maybe if EJ hadn't been eavesdropping on a conversation between two people, he wouldn't have heard someone's private thoughts. Everytime he sees them together, he attempts to either intrude or skulk around and it doesn't have anything to do with Sydney. Rafe has busted his ass trying to find out info about Sydney and her whereabouts and has kept nothing from EJ. Now, EJ has the nerve, b/c of jealousy and revenge to keep important info from an FBI agent who can help the most?? Doesn't seem like he is so interested in finding his daughter. I didn't see it as EJ eavesdropping on their conversation. They were hardly being discreet - and initially when EJ got there he turned away so as not to intrude - but hearing Sami's proclamation would have gotten anyone's attention. How he heard it doesn't change the fact that it was a really shitty thing for her to say. And I don't see him trying to intrude or skulk around everytime he sees them. If anything, he seems to be perfectly accepting of their relationship. He has included Rafe when asking Sami to come discuss ideas for finding Sydney, etc. Rafe seems to be the one who'd like to cut EJ out of the loop. I was happy to see EJ call him on his crap when he went to the townhouse on Christmas day and was informed by Arianna, of all people, that there might be a break in the case.
As to sharing the news about having recieved a note from the kidnapper that very clearly tells him not to tell anyone I think it simply shows EJ isn't willing to risk Sydney's safety or their opportunity to bring her home by banking on SupeRafe's questionable skills. Let's face it - at this point Rafe has hardly managed to be productive. By all appearances all he's managed to do is help Sami illegally attempt to get a taped confession from Stefano and when that didn't work illegally drugged the man only to find out he was telling the truth all along. He's basically had Kate falsely accused of being involved and tossed out one false hope after another. Gee...I can't imagine why EJ is less than enthusiastic to go running to such a successful sleuth, particularly when he just heard the guy say he plans to raise Sydney 'as his own'. Rafe would be the last person EJ should want to go to for help. Just ask Hilda. :huh:
Edited by SocRMum1, Dec 28 2009, 05:14 PM.
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Liz<3Days
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Dec 28 2009, 05:22 PM
Post #123
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- lazydazes
- Dec 28 2009, 04:33 PM
Poor Sydney. One day with EJ/Sami and she has already became a bargaining chip. It's ridiculous that Sydney is being swapped around like a ragdoll while her happiness/welfare is contingent upon what man Sami chooses. Isn't the child the most important thing in this whole crazy situation? For months, there has been a mad push for Sami to get her baby back even though she lied about the child in the beginning. Of course, that was justified, at least a little while ago. Now, since Sami isn't gungho over EJ, the sentiment is that she shouldn't get her baby back. Color me confused. :shrug: I just don't get it. WORD!
Sami and "wellfare of the child" have never met!
This was the same Sami that was trying to reunite EJole after EJ kicked Nicole and "THAT" out. She was the one that gave the money to Nicole to run away and told her that Sydneys with the best mother! So I guess thats not the case when she finds out that Syds may be hers? LOL
I still think TPTB waiting for AZ to come back to resolve this part of the SL..YES, folks, there's still more to come! I wouldnt be surprised that Syd is Nicole's baby!
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lazydazes
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Dec 28 2009, 09:37 PM
Post #124
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I still think TPTB waiting for AZ to come back to resolve this part of the SL..YES, folks, there's still more to come! I wouldnt be surprised that Syd is Nicole's baby!
I hope you're right because nothing would please me more than Sydney being Nicole's baby. AZ and the baby who portrays Sydney play off so well together. I miss watching those two together.
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Alligato
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Dec 28 2009, 11:48 PM
Post #125
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- lazydazes
- Dec 28 2009, 04:33 PM
Poor Sydney. One day with EJ/Sami and she has already became a bargaining chip. It's ridiculous that Sydney is being swapped around like a ragdoll while her happiness/welfare is contingent upon what man Sami chooses. Isn't the child the most important thing in this whole crazy situation? For months, there has been a mad push for Sami to get her baby back even though she lied about the child in the beginning. Of course, that was justified, at least a little while ago. Now, since Sami isn't gungho over EJ, the sentiment is that she shouldn't get her baby back. Color me confused. :shrug: I just don't get it. LMAO! You makes some excellent points here! Post more please! LOL!
If Sami wants to raise her children with Rafe and wants EJ to be nothing in her life other than "Johnny's father", that is fine with me. Why does that make her a bad person? Or an unworthy mother? Why does that justify EJ keeping her daughter from her? Don't get me wrong, I can't stand the woman and really wouldn't mind if she lost all of her men and her kids.
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daisy132
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Dec 28 2009, 11:58 PM
Post #126
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- Alligato
- Dec 28 2009, 11:48 PM
- lazydazes
- Dec 28 2009, 04:33 PM
Poor Sydney. One day with EJ/Sami and she has already became a bargaining chip. It's ridiculous that Sydney is being swapped around like a ragdoll while her happiness/welfare is contingent upon what man Sami chooses. Isn't the child the most important thing in this whole crazy situation? For months, there has been a mad push for Sami to get her baby back even though she lied about the child in the beginning. Of course, that was justified, at least a little while ago. Now, since Sami isn't gungho over EJ, the sentiment is that she shouldn't get her baby back. Color me confused. :shrug: I just don't get it.
LMAO! You makes some excellent points here! Post more please! LOL! If Sami wants to raise her children with Rafe and wants EJ to be nothing in her life other than "Johnny's father", that is fine with me. Why does that make her a bad person? Or an unworthy mother? Why does that justify EJ keeping her daughter from her? Don't get me wrong, I can't stand the woman and really wouldn't mind if she lost all of her men and her kids. It's not ok for Sami to raise Sydney with Rafe as her father because he's not! I can't think of ONE instant where I would give up my flesh and blood to my ex's girlfriend to raise as her own. Could any of you? So on that basis, and on what EJ heard Sami say to Rafe about his daughter, I hope that he files for, and gets full custody of Sydney, and gives Sami and the bore just visitation rights.
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Alligato
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Dec 29 2009, 12:19 AM
Post #127
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If a couple splits up/not married and they have children, there is a good chance that one or both will move on and find other loves that they want as father figures. This is all that happened.
Sami is in love with Rafe. She has a child with a man that she does not love or respect. Sami wants Rafe to be Sydney's other "father". Sami has done nothing wrong. Rafe will never be Sydney's father, so EJ really has no need to keep his kid from Sami...just have the joint custody with Sydney like he does with Johnny.
Now, if EJ wants to have a beef with Sami over the fact that she lied about her pregnancy and planned to keep his child from him forever, that's fine with me. But he seemed to have forgotten all about that. And for him to get jealous because Sami would prefer to play house with Rafe over him, that just makes him look even more stupid.
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Liz<3Days
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Dec 29 2009, 12:42 AM
Post #128
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I dont get the Rafe hate because it was Sami that put him in that position with her family. Sami would be in heaven if she didnt have to deal with EJ and his "disgusting" family. She wants the cake and doesnt share! What she fails to understand is that EJ is still going to be in Johnnys life unless he throws him out like THAT! So its not really fair to either man.
Safe are going to raise Sydney and EJ too (if Syd is Sami and EJs.) Some people here are just upset that its not their "horse" that won the race. Thats understandable, but Sami said those words not Rafe. This the reason why I have always hated Sami. She puts her men and the chase of said man in front of whats in the best interest of her family, then she whines about it later! She should of thought of that when she was having sex with EJ last Spring.
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IMissAremid
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Dec 29 2009, 04:57 AM
Post #129
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After all... tomorrow is another day!
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- Alligato
- Dec 29 2009, 12:19 AM
Sami has done nothing wrong.
Alligato... defending Sami? Does.Not.Compute. ;)
I would disagree that Sami has done nothing wrong. She supposedly had her big moment of clarity at Grace's grave where she said she was wrong in trying to keep EJ away from her daughter and keeping that secret from everyone, yet the writers wiped all that away with her little talk with Rafe on the pier (which EJ did absolutely nothing wrong in overhearing considering they were in a public place in broad daylight at an event where Sami knew EJ would be as EJ had planned the whole thing to try to get their daughter back) where she is telling Rafe that she wishes everything had worked out with her big plan to let her and Rafey play house with EJ's kid without him being in a position to have any role in the child's life. These things are kind of contradictory. And what we had with that pier scene was a lot different than her just being OK with EJ only as a bio dad but sharing her life romantically with Rafe. She's also exposed herself as being full of a lot of shit when she claimed her big reason for keeping EJ from his kid was to protect the child from Stefano when now even after EJ has gone completely against Stefano that still isn't good enough for Sami and she is lamenting having to allow EJ any access to his child at all (another layer of this hypocrisy was that having HER kid raised under Stefano's influence was an abomination yet she was cheerleading that as Sydney's fate before she knew the kid had her DNA). Unfortunately, Sami is still being a mighty hypocrite right now and that would bug me even if "my horse" wasn't behind in the race.
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IMissAremid
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Dec 29 2009, 04:59 AM
Post #130
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After all... tomorrow is another day!
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- Liz<3Days
- Dec 29 2009, 12:42 AM
I dont get the Rafe hate because it was Sami that put him in that position with her family. Rafe could have said no. Just as Sami could have learned a lesson from the mistakes they made with Grace, Rafe could have learned from those mistakes too but it doesn't look like he did.
Also, I haven't forgotten that it was RAFE who first pushed the idea of adopting a child he thought was EJ's (not Sami) and it was RAFE, Mr. Law Enforcement, who had those fraudulent adoption papers drawn up after one date. Rafe doesn't deserve a free pass here.
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ladyofthelake
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Dec 29 2009, 06:07 AM
Post #131
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Professor-in-training
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- SocRMum1
- Dec 28 2009, 05:12 PM
Thus far I haven't seen anything to indicate EJ is or has been doing anything to try to reconcile with Sami. Nothing. However, after listening to her spew that hypocritical crap to Rafe during the vigil about how it could have been so perfect for them if Nicole hadn't switched the babies - and Rafe responding that he'll 'raise Sydney as if she were my own' I wouldn't blame EJ one tiny bit if he wants to keep Rafe away from his kids...and Sami, too, for that matter.
Remember back a few years ago when Reilly would write the discovery of terrible secrets because people overheard since those discussing the topic couldn't keep their voices down? Or talked with a baby monitor on? :D Or were talking out loud to themselves and nearly got caught? It was merely a plot device, vague enough to be considered either way.
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lazydazes
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Dec 29 2009, 07:00 AM
Post #132
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Rafe could have said no. Just as Sami could have learned a lesson from the mistakes they made with Grace, Rafe could have learned from those mistakes too but it doesn't look like he did.
Also, I haven't forgotten that it was RAFE who first pushed the idea of adopting a child he thought was EJ's (not Sami) and it was RAFE, Mr. Law Enforcement, who had those fraudulent adoption papers drawn up after one date. Rafe doesn't deserve a free pass here.
Just how old is Sami, 10? No one is twisting Sami's arm here. She knows fully well what she wants. Rafe is feeling the heat because of the choices that she's making. Sami is a 35 year old woman whose actions can no longer be blamed on other individuals. I guess Rafe has one of those brainchips in Sami's head making her think and act the way that she does. Poor Rafe is in a bad position right now because he's doing the unthinkable: being involved with Samantha.
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I would disagree that Sami has done nothing wrong. She supposedly had her big moment of clarity at Grace's grave where she said she was wrong in trying to keep EJ away from her daughter and keeping that secret from everyone, yet the writers wiped all that away with her little talk with Rafe on the pier (which EJ did absolutely nothing wrong in overhearing considering they were in a public place in broad daylight at an event where Sami knew EJ would be as EJ had planned the whole thing to try to get their daughter back) where she is telling Rafe that she wishes everything had worked out with her big plan to let her and Rafey play house with EJ's kid without him being in a position to have any role in the child's life. These things are kind of contradictory. And what we had with that pier scene was a lot different than her just being OK with EJ only as a bio dad but sharing her life romantically with Rafe. She's also exposed herself as being full of a lot of shit when she claimed her big reason for keeping EJ from his kid was to protect the child from Stefano when now even after EJ has gone completely against Stefano that still isn't good enough for Sami and she is lamenting having to allow EJ any access to his child at all (another layer of this hypocrisy was that having HER kid raised under Stefano's influence was an abomination yet she was cheerleading that as Sydney's fate before she knew the kid had her DNA). Unfortunately, Sami is still being a mighty hypocrite right now and that would bug me even if "my horse" wasn't behind in the race
I still don't get why suddenly Sami's a hypocrite now. I think that this statement mirrors Nicole's argument when she took little Sydney in the first place. She knew that EJ didn't stand a ghost of a chance of seeing his little girl. But, of course, back then to some Sami's actions were justified and she was being viewed as being the "ultimate protector" of her child against the big bad Stefano. Suddenly, since she's not declaring her undying devotion to Elvis, Sami is now viewed as a hypocrite with some wanting the baby to be shielded from her reach. That's what seriously blows my mind. It was only a few scant weeks ago when cheers went up across the nation when she found out about little Syd. She's still the same woman that she was weeks ago. She just doesn't want any of EJ's koolaid any longer. Color me confused again because of the new push for EJ to keep Sydney away from Sami. Like I said, I don't get it. So what if she said what she did? Elvis can take it, he's a big boy. It's not like he doesn't know that Sami's involved with Rafe. Besides, Rafe wouldn't be taking EJ's place as the father. He would only be doing what so many stepparents do today. It happens.
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SocRMum1
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Dec 29 2009, 09:26 AM
Post #133
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Much prefers sweevil, snarky EJ over Father Figure Fucktard Eejiot.
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- lazydazes
- Dec 29 2009, 07:00 AM
I still don't get why suddenly Sami's a hypocrite now. I think that this statement mirrors Nicole's argument when she took little Sydney in the first place. She knew that EJ didn't stand a ghost of a chance of seeing his little girl. But, of course, back then to some Sami's actions were justified and she was being viewed as being the "ultimate protector" of her child against the big bad Stefano. Suddenly, since she's not declaring her undying devotion to Elvis, Sami is now viewed as a hypocrite with some wanting the baby to be shielded from her reach. That's what seriously blows my mind. It was only a few scant weeks ago when cheers went up across the nation when she found out about little Syd. She's still the same woman that she was weeks ago. She just doesn't want any of EJ's koolaid any longer. Color me confused again because of the new push for EJ to keep Sydney away from Sami. Like I said, I don't get it. So what if she said what she did? Elvis can take it, he's a big boy. It's not like he doesn't know that Sami's involved with Rafe. Besides, Rafe wouldn't be taking EJ's place as the father. He would only be doing what so many stepparents do today. It happens.
While I've always thought Sami's reasons for lying about her pregnancy and keeping EJ in the dark were stupid, particularly given the fact that Johnny was STILL living in the DiMansion, the reasons she gave were centered on the fact that she did not want the baby subjected to Stefano's influence. And despite the fact that EJ was at odds with his father when Sami found out she was pregnant, they went with that and showed EJ growing closer to his dear old Dad and working for him, etc. But now that EJ has made it abundantly clear that he has broken ties with his father, has told both Sami and Stefano that his children will not call the mansion 'home' while Stefano is there, has stated emphatically that if he has anything to do with it Stefano will never see those kids again...it is completely hypocritical of Sami to tell Rafe that she wishes things had worked out to enable them to keep EJ 'out of the picture'.
Sami can sleep with whomever she wants. She can marry another dozen or so men. But she doesn't have the right to pick and choose whom she wants to be the father to her children...and she has established a history of doing exactly that. She did it with Will - choosing Austin over Lucas. She tried to do it with Johnny (although that at least was understandable given the circumstances) and then when she initially found out she was pregnant with Sydney she begged Lucas to claim the baby is his. Rafe is certainly not the first in her series of insta-daddy candidates but after everything that has happened and all the things she's said during (her reasons for keeping the secret) and since (her apology to EJ about not telling him the truth) the one thing that seems to remain constant is Sami being hypocritical. Up until this point there was at least an argument as to why...now it's purely selfish, and that's what changed - at least for me.
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Luvndool
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Dec 29 2009, 09:35 AM
Post #134
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- SocRMum1
- Dec 29 2009, 09:26 AM
- lazydazes
- Dec 29 2009, 07:00 AM
I still don't get why suddenly Sami's a hypocrite now. I think that this statement mirrors Nicole's argument when she took little Sydney in the first place. She knew that EJ didn't stand a ghost of a chance of seeing his little girl. But, of course, back then to some Sami's actions were justified and she was being viewed as being the "ultimate protector" of her child against the big bad Stefano. Suddenly, since she's not declaring her undying devotion to Elvis, Sami is now viewed as a hypocrite with some wanting the baby to be shielded from her reach. That's what seriously blows my mind. It was only a few scant weeks ago when cheers went up across the nation when she found out about little Syd. She's still the same woman that she was weeks ago. She just doesn't want any of EJ's koolaid any longer. Color me confused again because of the new push for EJ to keep Sydney away from Sami. Like I said, I don't get it. So what if she said what she did? Elvis can take it, he's a big boy. It's not like he doesn't know that Sami's involved with Rafe. Besides, Rafe wouldn't be taking EJ's place as the father. He would only be doing what so many stepparents do today. It happens.
While I've always thought Sami's reasons for lying about her pregnancy and keeping EJ in the dark were stupid, particularly given the fact that Johnny was STILL living in the DiMansion, the reasons she gave were centered on the fact that she did not want the baby subjected to Stefano's influence. And despite the fact that EJ was at odds with his father when Sami found out she was pregnant, they went with that and showed EJ growing closer to his dear old Dad and working for him, etc. But now that EJ has made it abundantly clear that he has broken ties with his father, has told both Sami and Stefano that his children will not call the mansion 'home' while Stefano is there, has stated emphatically that if he has anything to do with it Stefano will never see those kids again...it is completely hypocritical of Sami to tell Rafe that she wishes things had worked out to enable them to keep EJ 'out of the picture'. Sami can sleep with whomever she wants. She can marry another dozen or so men. But she doesn't have the right to pick and choose whom she wants to be the father to her children...and she has established a history of doing exactly that. She did it with Will - choosing Austin over Lucas. She tried to do it with Johnny (although that at least was understandable given the circumstances) and then when she initially found out she was pregnant with Sydney she begged Lucas to claim the baby is his. Rafe is certainly not the first in her series of insta-daddy candidates but after everything that has happened and all the things she's said during (her reasons for keeping the secret) and since (her apology to EJ about not telling him the truth) the one thing that seems to remain constant is Sami being hypocritical. Up until this point there was at least an argument as to why...now it's purely selfish, and that's what changed - at least for me. Nicely written SocRMum1. You have articulated my thoughts better than I could have myself. Bravo! :smooch:
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Paxton
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Dec 29 2009, 10:42 AM
Post #135
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- IMissAremid
- Dec 29 2009, 04:57 AM
She supposedly had her big moment of clarity at Grace's grave where she said she was wrong in trying to keep EJ away from her daughter and keeping that secret from everyone, yet the writers wiped all that away with her little talk with Rafe on the pier (which EJ did absolutely nothing wrong in overhearing considering they were in a public place in broad daylight at an event where Sami knew EJ would be as EJ had planned the whole thing to try to get their daughter back) where she is telling Rafe that she wishes everything had worked out with her big plan to let her and Rafey play house with EJ's kid without him being in a position to have any role in the child's life. These things are kind of contradictory. See, I don't think those things are contradictory at all, and here's why. Circumstances changed, significantly, between Sami's alleged revelation/apology and her comments to Rafe on the pier. At the time of the graveside chat, both EJ and Sami thought their daughter was dead and thus, I can see that from both their perspectives there was no reason to draw out the nastiness any further. It wasn't all that long before the graveside chat that Sami had angrily told EJ she would do the same thing all over again, was it? So one could argue Sami having this revelation that she was wrong was the inconsistency. We have one incident of Sami seeming to be sorry for trying to hide her child from EJ and more than one incident after the Grace reveal of Sami regretting EJ ever knew about their child.
But more importantly, as I noted, things changed, dramatically, after that talk. Now, had, for example, had EJ gone to visit Grace's grave after their talk and before the full reveal and Sami and Rafe were there talking about how sad they were they couldn't be raising Grace together and what a pain it was EJ was in their lives, then I would agree that would seem to be contradictory. But when Sami had that talk with EJ, she thought that issue of keeping her child from him was over. Now, she's learned that child is alive and she has to deal with this whole new problem of EJ's involvement--she can't hide Sydney again since he knows about her. But it doesn't stop her from wishing she could just be raising Sydney with the man she loves instead of having to share her with EJ. Sami really isn't sorry she hid their child from EJ; she's only sorry her plan didn't work, and it cost her nothing to tell EJ, once the plan failed permanently, she shouldn't have done it. She was risking nothing at the time because as far as she knew their child was dead and I don't doubt she would have had some legitimate sympathy that EJ never got to know his daughter. But, things change.
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While I've always thought Sami's reasons for lying about her pregnancy and keeping EJ in the dark were stupid, particularly given the fact that Johnny was STILL living in the DiMansion, the reasons she gave were centered on the fact that she did not want the baby subjected to Stefano's influence. And despite the fact that EJ was at odds with his father when Sami found out she was pregnant, they went with that and showed EJ growing closer to his dear old Dad and working for him, etc. But now that EJ has made it abundantly clear that he has broken ties with his father, has told both Sami and Stefano that his children will not call the mansion 'home' while Stefano is there, has stated emphatically that if he has anything to do with it Stefano will never see those kids again...it is completely hypocritical of Sami to tell Rafe that she wishes things had worked out to enable them to keep EJ 'out of the picture'.
EJ hasn't broken with Stefano because he wants to be a better man (Exhibit "A" is the drug business). He's broken with Stefano because he pissed him off by participating in the babypalooza deception. Besides which, to use lazydazes' question about Sami, what is EJ, 10 (given his SORASing it's a more reasonable question than it appears looking at him, I'll admit)? He's a grown-ass man who fully participated in the attempts to kill Philip and it was all his own idea to have Sami's cousin kidnapped. Even though Sami doesn't know about the drug business (yet), I can't blame her for not being impressed that EJ has had a road-to-Damascus revelation. I haven't noticed him taking any vow of poverty, to the contrary, what I've seen is him supposedly taking Stefano's possessions in his name--which he did PRIOR to finding out Stefano had deceived him and which he did because he was upset that Kate might get the DiMera goodies. All I see is EJ trying to take daddy's place and be Head DiMera without Stefano's interference; he wants the house and the money and the power and the influence. Even if he throws Stefano out he doesn't seem to me to be changing his lifestyle at all, which is what matters. Not that I mind, because I don't want EJ to revert to early 2008 diaper-changing stroller-pushing EJ, but the point is that EJ hasn't become a "better" man.
Edited by Paxton, Dec 29 2009, 10:43 AM.
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IMissAremid
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Dec 29 2009, 11:32 AM
Post #136
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After all... tomorrow is another day!
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- Paxton
- Dec 29 2009, 10:42 AM
Circumstances changed, significantly, between Sami's alleged revelation/apology and her comments to Rafe on the pier. At the time of the graveside chat, both EJ and Sami thought their daughter was dead and thus, I can see that from both their perspectives there was no reason to draw out the nastiness any further. It wasn't all that long before the graveside chat that Sami had angrily told EJ she would do the same thing all over again, was it? So one could argue Sami having this revelation that she was wrong was the inconsistency. We have one incident of Sami seeming to be sorry for trying to hide her child from EJ and more than one incident after the Grace reveal of Sami regretting EJ ever knew about their child.
But more importantly, as I noted, things changed, dramatically, after that talk. Now, had, for example, had EJ gone to visit Grace's grave after their talk and before the full reveal and Sami and Rafe were there talking about how sad they were they couldn't be raising Grace together and what a pain it was EJ was in their lives, then I would agree that would seem to be contradictory. But when Sami had that talk with EJ, she thought that issue of keeping her child from him was over. Now, she's learned that child is alive and she has to deal with this whole new problem of EJ's involvement--she can't hide Sydney again since he knows about her. But it doesn't stop her from wishing she could just be raising Sydney with the man she loves instead of having to share her with EJ. Sami really isn't sorry she hid their child from EJ; she's only sorry her plan didn't work, and it cost her nothing to tell EJ, once the plan failed permanently, she shouldn't have done it. She was risking nothing at the time because as far as she knew their child was dead and I don't doubt she would have had some legitimate sympathy that EJ never got to know his daughter. But, things change.
Well, this still doesn't make the way they are writing Sami make any more sense to me when (as has been a problem throughout this story) EJ was going to be in the life of her kids regardless as a father to Johnny whether Sami's big keep Sydney away from him plot was successful or not.
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SocRMum1
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Dec 29 2009, 11:38 AM
Post #137
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Much prefers sweevil, snarky EJ over Father Figure Fucktard Eejiot.
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^^ I didn't say that EJ has broken with Stefano to become a better man. My point was that Sami's reasoning for hiding the truth about their daughter was the influence Stefano would have on her life. EJ has since very emphatically broken away from that influence - thus it's hypocritical, just as IMiss said, for that now to not be enough for Sami.
Your point about circumstances changing doesn't fly with me as to whether Sami is being contradictory because the fact is - she told EJ she was sorry she had kept the truth from him. She believed Grace was their daughter both when she was alive and after she died - so I don't see the fact that the circumstance changed making any difference. In fact, Sami admitted while looking through Sydney's baby book that she missed so much of her life because of her own lies. So it would seem that she finally was acknowledging that her choices were poor in how she handled things with their second child...so lamenting to Rafe a few days or weeks later that she is sorry EJ will now be involved seems completely contradictory to me. And it's only compounded by the fact that EJ was already involved and always would be through Johnny. I have never understood how adding a new child to that mix changes anything for Sami - it just seems stupid. :shrug:
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six
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Dec 29 2009, 11:56 AM
Post #138
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- Paxton
- Dec 29 2009, 10:42 AM
- IMissAremid
- Dec 29 2009, 04:57 AM
She supposedly had her big moment of clarity at Grace's grave where she said she was wrong in trying to keep EJ away from her daughter and keeping that secret from everyone, yet the writers wiped all that away with her little talk with Rafe on the pier (which EJ did absolutely nothing wrong in overhearing considering they were in a public place in broad daylight at an event where Sami knew EJ would be as EJ had planned the whole thing to try to get their daughter back) where she is telling Rafe that she wishes everything had worked out with her big plan to let her and Rafey play house with EJ's kid without him being in a position to have any role in the child's life. These things are kind of contradictory.
See, I don't think those things are contradictory at all, and here's why. Circumstances changed, significantly, between Sami's alleged revelation/apology and her comments to Rafe on the pier. At the time of the graveside chat, both EJ and Sami thought their daughter was dead and thus, I can see that from both their perspectives there was no reason to draw out the nastiness any further. It wasn't all that long before the graveside chat that Sami had angrily told EJ she would do the same thing all over again, was it? So one could argue Sami having this revelation that she was wrong was the inconsistency. We have one incident of Sami seeming to be sorry for trying to hide her child from EJ and more than one incident after the Grace reveal of Sami regretting EJ ever knew about their child. But more importantly, as I noted, things changed, dramatically, after that talk. Now, had, for example, had EJ gone to visit Grace's grave after their talk and before the full reveal and Sami and Rafe were there talking about how sad they were they couldn't be raising Grace together and what a pain it was EJ was in their lives, then I would agree that would seem to be contradictory. But when Sami had that talk with EJ, she thought that issue of keeping her child from him was over. Now, she's learned that child is alive and she has to deal with this whole new problem of EJ's involvement--she can't hide Sydney again since he knows about her. But it doesn't stop her from wishing she could just be raising Sydney with the man she loves instead of having to share her with EJ. Sami really isn't sorry she hid their child from EJ; she's only sorry her plan didn't work, and it cost her nothing to tell EJ, once the plan failed permanently, she shouldn't have done it. She was risking nothing at the time because as far as she knew their child was dead and I don't doubt she would have had some legitimate sympathy that EJ never got to know his daughter. But, things change. - Quote:
-
While I've always thought Sami's reasons for lying about her pregnancy and keeping EJ in the dark were stupid, particularly given the fact that Johnny was STILL living in the DiMansion, the reasons she gave were centered on the fact that she did not want the baby subjected to Stefano's influence. And despite the fact that EJ was at odds with his father when Sami found out she was pregnant, they went with that and showed EJ growing closer to his dear old Dad and working for him, etc. But now that EJ has made it abundantly clear that he has broken ties with his father, has told both Sami and Stefano that his children will not call the mansion 'home' while Stefano is there, has stated emphatically that if he has anything to do with it Stefano will never see those kids again...it is completely hypocritical of Sami to tell Rafe that she wishes things had worked out to enable them to keep EJ 'out of the picture'.
EJ hasn't broken with Stefano because he wants to be a better man (Exhibit "A" is the drug business). He's broken with Stefano because he pissed him off by participating in the babypalooza deception. Besides which, to use lazydazes' question about Sami, what is EJ, 10 (given his SORASing it's a more reasonable question than it appears looking at him, I'll admit)? He's a grown-ass man who fully participated in the attempts to kill Philip and it was all his own idea to have Sami's cousin kidnapped. Even though Sami doesn't know about the drug business (yet), I can't blame her for not being impressed that EJ has had a road-to-Damascus revelation. I haven't noticed him taking any vow of poverty, to the contrary, what I've seen is him supposedly taking Stefano's possessions in his name--which he did PRIOR to finding out Stefano had deceived him and which he did because he was upset that Kate might get the DiMera goodies. All I see is EJ trying to take daddy's place and be Head DiMera without Stefano's interference; he wants the house and the money and the power and the influence. Even if he throws Stefano out he doesn't seem to me to be changing his lifestyle at all, which is what matters. Not that I mind, because I don't want EJ to revert to early 2008 diaper-changing stroller-pushing EJ, but the point is that EJ hasn't become a "better" man. The problem with that line of thought is that Sami just said she was wrong for hiding Sydney (not Grace) during the time that Nicole had her. I'm referring to the scene that aired when EJ and Sami were looking at Sydney's baby book, and Sami took the blame for setting the plan in motion, and talked about feeling what EJ felt when he spoke of not knowing Grace. When EJ told her it was okay, she told him that it wasn't. So hiding Sydney wasn't okay when Nicole was on the run with her, but suddenly it is again now that an unknown person has her? It makes no sense.
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aimees76
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Dec 29 2009, 12:07 PM
Post #139
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- daisy132
- Dec 28 2009, 11:58 PM
- Alligato
- Dec 28 2009, 11:48 PM
- lazydazes
- Dec 28 2009, 04:33 PM
Poor Sydney. One day with EJ/Sami and she has already became a bargaining chip. It's ridiculous that Sydney is being swapped around like a ragdoll while her happiness/welfare is contingent upon what man Sami chooses. Isn't the child the most important thing in this whole crazy situation? For months, there has been a mad push for Sami to get her baby back even though she lied about the child in the beginning. Of course, that was justified, at least a little while ago. Now, since Sami isn't gungho over EJ, the sentiment is that she shouldn't get her baby back. Color me confused. :shrug: I just don't get it.
LMAO! You makes some excellent points here! Post more please! LOL! If Sami wants to raise her children with Rafe and wants EJ to be nothing in her life other than "Johnny's father", that is fine with me. Why does that make her a bad person? Or an unworthy mother? Why does that justify EJ keeping her daughter from her? Don't get me wrong, I can't stand the woman and really wouldn't mind if she lost all of her men and her kids.
It's not ok for Sami to raise Sydney with Rafe as her father because he's not! I can't think of ONE instant where I would give up my flesh and blood to my ex's girlfriend to raise as her own. Could any of you? So on that basis, and on what EJ heard Sami say to Rafe about his daughter, I hope that he files for, and gets full custody of Sydney, and gives Sami and the bore just visitation rights. Yeah well, EJ wasn't Allie's father but it was A-ok for him to love and raise her as if she was his own, and even refer to her as a Dimera, when he and Sami were playing house .... it was even oh so sweet and proof of what a wonderful father he was and how much he loved Sami, because he loved Allie as much as Johnny even though she wasn't his. It is only not ok in this case because this is EJ's kid being loved by a man that Sami loves that is not EJ.
And no, I still am not a Safe fan, and never will be.
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aimees76
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Dec 29 2009, 12:22 PM
Post #140
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- Paxton
- Dec 29 2009, 10:42 AM
- IMissAremid
- Dec 29 2009, 04:57 AM
She supposedly had her big moment of clarity at Grace's grave where she said she was wrong in trying to keep EJ away from her daughter and keeping that secret from everyone, yet the writers wiped all that away with her little talk with Rafe on the pier (which EJ did absolutely nothing wrong in overhearing considering they were in a public place in broad daylight at an event where Sami knew EJ would be as EJ had planned the whole thing to try to get their daughter back) where she is telling Rafe that she wishes everything had worked out with her big plan to let her and Rafey play house with EJ's kid without him being in a position to have any role in the child's life. These things are kind of contradictory.
See, I don't think those things are contradictory at all, and here's why. Circumstances changed, significantly, between Sami's alleged revelation/apology and her comments to Rafe on the pier. At the time of the graveside chat, both EJ and Sami thought their daughter was dead and thus, I can see that from both their perspectives there was no reason to draw out the nastiness any further. It wasn't all that long before the graveside chat that Sami had angrily told EJ she would do the same thing all over again, was it? So one could argue Sami having this revelation that she was wrong was the inconsistency. We have one incident of Sami seeming to be sorry for trying to hide her child from EJ and more than one incident after the Grace reveal of Sami regretting EJ ever knew about their child. But more importantly, as I noted, things changed, dramatically, after that talk. Now, had, for example, had EJ gone to visit Grace's grave after their talk and before the full reveal and Sami and Rafe were there talking about how sad they were they couldn't be raising Grace together and what a pain it was EJ was in their lives, then I would agree that would seem to be contradictory. But when Sami had that talk with EJ, she thought that issue of keeping her child from him was over. Now, she's learned that child is alive and she has to deal with this whole new problem of EJ's involvement--she can't hide Sydney again since he knows about her. But it doesn't stop her from wishing she could just be raising Sydney with the man she loves instead of having to share her with EJ. Sami really isn't sorry she hid their child from EJ; she's only sorry her plan didn't work, and it cost her nothing to tell EJ, once the plan failed permanently, she shouldn't have done it. She was risking nothing at the time because as far as she knew their child was dead and I don't doubt she would have had some legitimate sympathy that EJ never got to know his daughter. But, things change. - Quote:
-
While I've always thought Sami's reasons for lying about her pregnancy and keeping EJ in the dark were stupid, particularly given the fact that Johnny was STILL living in the DiMansion, the reasons she gave were centered on the fact that she did not want the baby subjected to Stefano's influence. And despite the fact that EJ was at odds with his father when Sami found out she was pregnant, they went with that and showed EJ growing closer to his dear old Dad and working for him, etc. But now that EJ has made it abundantly clear that he has broken ties with his father, has told both Sami and Stefano that his children will not call the mansion 'home' while Stefano is there, has stated emphatically that if he has anything to do with it Stefano will never see those kids again...it is completely hypocritical of Sami to tell Rafe that she wishes things had worked out to enable them to keep EJ 'out of the picture'.
EJ hasn't broken with Stefano because he wants to be a better man (Exhibit "A" is the drug business). He's broken with Stefano because he pissed him off by participating in the babypalooza deception. Besides which, to use lazydazes' question about Sami, what is EJ, 10 (given his SORASing it's a more reasonable question than it appears looking at him, I'll admit)? He's a grown-ass man who fully participated in the attempts to kill Philip and it was all his own idea to have Sami's cousin kidnapped. Even though Sami doesn't know about the drug business (yet), I can't blame her for not being impressed that EJ has had a road-to-Damascus revelation. I haven't noticed him taking any vow of poverty, to the contrary, what I've seen is him supposedly taking Stefano's possessions in his name--which he did PRIOR to finding out Stefano had deceived him and which he did because he was upset that Kate might get the DiMera goodies. All I see is EJ trying to take daddy's place and be Head DiMera without Stefano's interference; he wants the house and the money and the power and the influence. Even if he throws Stefano out he doesn't seem to me to be changing his lifestyle at all, which is what matters. Not that I mind, because I don't want EJ to revert to early 2008 diaper-changing stroller-pushing EJ, but the point is that EJ hasn't become a "better" man. I heart this post a lot.
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