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Weekly Discussion: 1/11-15; R.I.P. Mickey Horton
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Topic Started: Jan 9 2010, 06:12 PM (18,653 Views)
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PhoenixRising05
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Jan 12 2010, 01:21 AM
Post #81
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- cassie1013
- Jan 12 2010, 01:14 AM
- PhoenixRising05
- Jan 12 2010, 01:07 AM
- cassie1013
- Jan 12 2010, 12:56 AM
Just finished watching Monday's show.
I think this Mickey story is a mess. It's too bad. Yes, some of the scenes are good, but there's sooo many issues holding the story back from its full potential. Firstly, for those who haven't been watching years and years - the changing image of Mickey is confusing. What if you started watching 5 years ago and only knew the last 2 recasts? Not seeing Mickey, as I suspected, is hurting this story. The other problem is that everything is happening 'all of a sudden' and in the same day. Suzanne is good, but I felt the scenes were unrealistic. You wouldn't be that calm if your husband just died - SUDDENLY - 2 hours ago. The way she was reminiscing about Mickey already really put me off.
And where the fuck is Hope? Bitch, your effin' uncle died - get yo' ass over there...again! SO stupid that the writers had her leave. Everything kind of fell flat the moment Maggie was spending time with Melanie and Nathan. Not to bash newer characters, but in a pivotal story - killing off a LEGACY character - they become the weak links due to lack of history. Having Hope there initially was great, but she should have also been there with Melanie, Nathan, Doug and Julie. And WTF to Mickey's text message? Again - SO STUPID! Totally took me out of the moment. It was nice seeing Julie, though. Susan always captures my attention on screen.
How is Maggie calm? She falls apart constantly. She fell apart upon seeing the text. She fell apart describing when she found him. She fell apart when Melanie said what she said. She was emotional in her scenes with Melanie and fell apart again in Nathan's arms on her way out. She then fell apart again upon realizing the text got deleted. It's not like she's skipping around, acting like nothing happened. As for Hope, she went to tell her frail grandmother that her son died. If that isn't a reason not to be there, I don't know what is. She wouldn't just tell her and leave her. If Frances was able, I'm sure we would've seen the scenes where Hope tells her and the fallout from those.
But the fact she could walk around and function, having conversations - like the one with Melanie, in particular - was odd to me. I get this is a soap, but that sort of stuff would come in the next couple days. If you just found out your husband died, suddenly - wouldn't you be in a state of emotional shock?! Where you would just sit on a couch, and can't believe what just happened? The falling apart was fine, too, but again, the way it was happening - with Maggie walking all around, interacting - was just weird. It was like Mickey died a few days ago and not like, an hour ago. They could have had Hope tell Gran off screen. I missed not seeing her in today's ep, especially since she's a key character and a Horton. So, Maggie was just supposed to be closed off? I've lost alot of relatives and myself and my family have all still been able to have conversations and to function. Sure, it's difficult but you don't just shut down. If anything, it's all about the situation. If someone passes away the way Mickey did, it's devastating but not the same as a 23 year old dying in a car accident. That kind of thing hits you harder and may lead to more of a closed off, shattering reaction where the mother of that 23 year old may stare blankly for days or something. I just think expecting that sort of reaction from her makes very little sense. You don't just stop functioning. No one does.
As for Hope, she did tell her offscreen but it would make no sense if she just rushed back from her grandmother's. For one, Doug and Julie are with Maggie and so is Nathan. Also, Alice is elderly and frail. She just learned her son died. Would you leave a woman like that after just telling her that news? I know I wouldn't. Doug and Julie left to see Alice at the end of today's episode so with them going to Alice, Hope would likely be more ok about leaving her to return to Mickey. Expecting Hope to just run off and tell Alice and then to leave would not be true to character and would be considered downright rude and cruel if a person did it in real life.
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dc cubs
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Jan 12 2010, 01:22 AM
Post #82
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- cassie1013
- Jan 12 2010, 12:56 AM
The only problem I see with this Carly story is a lot is revolving around her right now, but I feel like when Carly is actually on screen she doesn't deliver to the expectations of how other characters describe her. I don't want to say she falls flat, but she kind of does. Vivian, Victor and flashback-Lawrence make her sound like some crazy, slutty bitch but she's not really. It was these sorts of storylines that confused me when I was younger (like Sami saying she wanted Austin over and over, but Lucus was the rooting interest - didn't clue in for the longest time, lol). It's starting to annoy me.
Carly wasn't a crazy, slutty bitch her first time on the show. Granted her sleeping with Bo right now is not painting her in the best light.
However, consider the sources you are referencing. Victor pretty much calls any woman a bitch. Brady even said that to him today. He is a misogynistic, grumpy old man. Carly married Victor because Bo wouldn't let himself love Carly as he was grieving Hope. Bo finally admitted his feelings to Carly via a letter but of course Vic switched things up so Carly got a goodbye letter from Bo instead. When Bo and Carly realized Victor did this to them, Carly divorced Vic and started a relationship with Bo. Vic then tried to kill Bo. Who is the villain there?
Check Kenny's buried alive clips to see how crazy Vivian was during the Buried Alive storyline. She is not exactly the best person to judge anyone.
Lawrence was mentally ill so his opinions don't really wash either.
I'm not saying Carly is perfect. She's made mistakes but she's not the villain that Victor, Vivian and Lawrence make her out to be. Would Maggie have offered to let her stay at her house if she was such a bad person?
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Kenny
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Jan 12 2010, 01:24 AM
Post #83
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- dc cubs
- Jan 12 2010, 01:22 AM
Check Kenny's buried alive clips to see how crazy Vivian was during the Buried Alive storyline. Yes! Please do. They're fabulous.
Louise Sorel is especially terrifying in Clip #1 and Clip #7.
http://daytimeroyaltyonline.com/topic/8236255/1/
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dc cubs
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Jan 12 2010, 01:26 AM
Post #84
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- Kenny
- Jan 12 2010, 01:21 AM
- cassie1013
- Jan 12 2010, 01:14 AM
But the fact she could walk around and function, having conversations - like the one with Melanie, in particular - was odd to me. I get this is a soap, but that sort of stuff would come in the next couple days. If you just found out your husband died, suddenly - wouldn't you be in a state of emotional shock?! Where you would just sit on a couch, and can't believe what just happened?
The falling apart was fine, too, but again, the way it was happening - with Maggie walking all around, interacting - was just weird. It was like Mickey died a few days ago and not like, an hour ago.
Yep. I have the same complaints with this story that you do. They are playing this story very similar so far to when Tom Horton died. Alice never fell apart. In fact Maggie has been much more emotional than Alice was at the time. Granted there was more Hortons at that time.
I'm OK with how they have it playing out so far. There is no manual on how someone is supposed to grieve. Everyone handles things differently.
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cassie1013
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Jan 12 2010, 01:29 AM
Post #85
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- PhoenixRising05
- Jan 12 2010, 01:21 AM
- cassie1013
- Jan 12 2010, 01:14 AM
- PhoenixRising05
- Jan 12 2010, 01:07 AM
- cassie1013
- Jan 12 2010, 12:56 AM
Just finished watching Monday's show.
I think this Mickey story is a mess. It's too bad. Yes, some of the scenes are good, but there's sooo many issues holding the story back from its full potential. Firstly, for those who haven't been watching years and years - the changing image of Mickey is confusing. What if you started watching 5 years ago and only knew the last 2 recasts? Not seeing Mickey, as I suspected, is hurting this story. The other problem is that everything is happening 'all of a sudden' and in the same day. Suzanne is good, but I felt the scenes were unrealistic. You wouldn't be that calm if your husband just died - SUDDENLY - 2 hours ago. The way she was reminiscing about Mickey already really put me off.
And where the fuck is Hope? Bitch, your effin' uncle died - get yo' ass over there...again! SO stupid that the writers had her leave. Everything kind of fell flat the moment Maggie was spending time with Melanie and Nathan. Not to bash newer characters, but in a pivotal story - killing off a LEGACY character - they become the weak links due to lack of history. Having Hope there initially was great, but she should have also been there with Melanie, Nathan, Doug and Julie. And WTF to Mickey's text message? Again - SO STUPID! Totally took me out of the moment. It was nice seeing Julie, though. Susan always captures my attention on screen.
How is Maggie calm? She falls apart constantly. She fell apart upon seeing the text. She fell apart describing when she found him. She fell apart when Melanie said what she said. She was emotional in her scenes with Melanie and fell apart again in Nathan's arms on her way out. She then fell apart again upon realizing the text got deleted. It's not like she's skipping around, acting like nothing happened. As for Hope, she went to tell her frail grandmother that her son died. If that isn't a reason not to be there, I don't know what is. She wouldn't just tell her and leave her. If Frances was able, I'm sure we would've seen the scenes where Hope tells her and the fallout from those.
But the fact she could walk around and function, having conversations - like the one with Melanie, in particular - was odd to me. I get this is a soap, but that sort of stuff would come in the next couple days. If you just found out your husband died, suddenly - wouldn't you be in a state of emotional shock?! Where you would just sit on a couch, and can't believe what just happened? The falling apart was fine, too, but again, the way it was happening - with Maggie walking all around, interacting - was just weird. It was like Mickey died a few days ago and not like, an hour ago. They could have had Hope tell Gran off screen. I missed not seeing her in today's ep, especially since she's a key character and a Horton.
So, Maggie was just supposed to be closed off? I've lost alot of relatives and myself and my family have all still been able to have conversations and to function. Sure, it's difficult but you don't just shut down. If anything, it's all about the situation. If someone passes away the way Mickey did, it's devastating but not the same as a 23 year old dying in a car accident. That kind of thing hits you harder and may lead to more of a closed off, shattering reaction where the mother of that 23 year old may stare blankly for days or something. I just think expecting that sort of reaction from her makes very little sense. You don't just stop functioning. No one does. As for Hope, she did tell her offscreen but it would make no sense if she just rushed back from her grandmother's. For one, Doug and Julie are with Maggie and so is Nathan. Also, Alice is elderly and frail. She just learned her son died. Would you leave a woman like that after just telling her that news? I know I wouldn't. Doug and Julie left to see Alice at the end of today's episode so with them going to Alice, Hope would likely be more ok about leaving her to return to Mickey. Expecting Hope to just run off and tell Alice and then to leave would not be true to character and would be considered downright rude and cruel if a person did it in real life. Re: Hope, it's not the characters actions that are annoying me, more just the writers decision. That's fine she said she was going to tell Gran, I'm glad that was acknowledged knowing this show, but it easily could have been written between Friday and Monday's show off screen.
I completely hear you and agree that no one stops functioning. But I guess what I'm getting at here is that I feel that there's an element of shock missing. Like Maggie reminiscing about moments with Mickey - this story is coming off as a terminally ill man who was expected to die. Still sad, but with Maggie prepared for it.
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cassie1013
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Jan 12 2010, 01:30 AM
Post #86
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- Kenny
- Jan 12 2010, 01:24 AM
- dc cubs
- Jan 12 2010, 01:22 AM
Check Kenny's buried alive clips to see how crazy Vivian was during the Buried Alive storyline.
Yes! Please do. They're fabulous. Louise Sorel is especially terrifying in Clip #1 and Clip #7. http://daytimeroyaltyonline.com/topic/8236255/1/ Those clips finally mean something to me having watched Carly on screen, and Carly/Vivian interact. I had watched them way back when you posted them (I think maybe a year ago or so?), but they didn't have the same effect out-of-context. I didn't really know who Carly was and thought Vivian was supposed to be comic relief, so it didn't make sense at the time, lol!
Sourel gives me chills now, though.
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PhoenixRising05
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Jan 12 2010, 01:32 AM
Post #87
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- cassie1013
- Jan 12 2010, 01:29 AM
- PhoenixRising05
- Jan 12 2010, 01:21 AM
- cassie1013
- Jan 12 2010, 01:14 AM
- PhoenixRising05
- Jan 12 2010, 01:07 AM
Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
But the fact she could walk around and function, having conversations - like the one with Melanie, in particular - was odd to me. I get this is a soap, but that sort of stuff would come in the next couple days. If you just found out your husband died, suddenly - wouldn't you be in a state of emotional shock?! Where you would just sit on a couch, and can't believe what just happened? The falling apart was fine, too, but again, the way it was happening - with Maggie walking all around, interacting - was just weird. It was like Mickey died a few days ago and not like, an hour ago. They could have had Hope tell Gran off screen. I missed not seeing her in today's ep, especially since she's a key character and a Horton.
So, Maggie was just supposed to be closed off? I've lost alot of relatives and myself and my family have all still been able to have conversations and to function. Sure, it's difficult but you don't just shut down. If anything, it's all about the situation. If someone passes away the way Mickey did, it's devastating but not the same as a 23 year old dying in a car accident. That kind of thing hits you harder and may lead to more of a closed off, shattering reaction where the mother of that 23 year old may stare blankly for days or something. I just think expecting that sort of reaction from her makes very little sense. You don't just stop functioning. No one does. As for Hope, she did tell her offscreen but it would make no sense if she just rushed back from her grandmother's. For one, Doug and Julie are with Maggie and so is Nathan. Also, Alice is elderly and frail. She just learned her son died. Would you leave a woman like that after just telling her that news? I know I wouldn't. Doug and Julie left to see Alice at the end of today's episode so with them going to Alice, Hope would likely be more ok about leaving her to return to Mickey. Expecting Hope to just run off and tell Alice and then to leave would not be true to character and would be considered downright rude and cruel if a person did it in real life.
Re: Hope, it's not the characters actions that are annoying me, more just the writers decision. That's fine she said she was going to tell Gran, I'm glad that was acknowledged knowing this show, but it easily could have been written between Friday and Monday's show off screen. I completely hear you and agree that no one stops functioning. But I guess what I'm getting at here is that I feel that there's an element of shock missing. Like Maggie reminiscing about moments with Mickey - this story is coming off as a terminally ill man who was expected to die. Still sad, but with Maggie prepared for it. Even if it played out offscreen between Friday and Monday, leaving Alice alone would've made them all look like cruel idiots so the fact that they have everyone so concerned about leaving either Maggie and Hope alone is realistic and the completely right approach.
Fair enough on the shock element. I disagree but can understand what your saying.
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Kenny
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Jan 12 2010, 01:34 AM
Post #88
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- cassie1013
- Jan 12 2010, 01:30 AM
Those clips finally mean something to me having watched Carly on screen, and Carly/Vivian interact. I had watched them way back when you posted them (I think maybe a year ago or so?), but they didn't have the same effect out-of-context. I didn't really know who Carly was and thought Vivian was supposed to be comic relief, so it didn't make sense at the time, lol! Oh, those clips were different. Terrible quality.
The clips in the thread I linked above are new and great quality. Someone on YouTube was kind enough to upload much of the storyline back in November. The clip quality is surprisingly good. :)
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duckie
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Jan 12 2010, 01:34 AM
Post #89
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- cassie1013
- Jan 12 2010, 12:56 AM
The only problem I see with this Carly story is a lot is revolving around her right now, but I feel like when Carly is actually on screen she doesn't deliver to the expectations of how other characters describe her. I don't want to say she falls flat, but she kind of does. Vivian, Victor and flashback-Lawrence make her sound like some crazy, slutty bitch but she's not really. It was these sorts of storylines that confused me when I was younger (like Sami saying she wanted Austin over and over, but Lucus was the rooting interest - didn't clue in for the longest time, lol). It's starting to annoy me.
I don't think it's a question of Carly falling flat, it's the fact that she's really not that person Victor, Vivian, and crazy Lawrence described, and that's exactly the problem with the way it's being presented. The only person who's really on her side right now is Bo (and Daniel when he's on). But the people who talk about Carly the most are Victor and Vivian, who constantly talk about her in such disparaging terms that really don't suit her. All the people who used to like Carly when she was on the show before either aren't on the show anymore, appear to be nice to her but talk behind her back (like Lexie and to a lesser extent Maggie), treat her like a pariah (Roman and Caroline), or simply don't have any scenes with her.
Hope disliked her before she had a reason to, and was fueled in that belief by Victor. Now she may feel justified now, but she really had determined her feelings for Carly based on nothing but Carly's presence in the house.
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cassie1013
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Jan 12 2010, 01:35 AM
Post #90
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- dc cubs
- Jan 12 2010, 01:22 AM
- cassie1013
- Jan 12 2010, 12:56 AM
The only problem I see with this Carly story is a lot is revolving around her right now, but I feel like when Carly is actually on screen she doesn't deliver to the expectations of how other characters describe her. I don't want to say she falls flat, but she kind of does. Vivian, Victor and flashback-Lawrence make her sound like some crazy, slutty bitch but she's not really. It was these sorts of storylines that confused me when I was younger (like Sami saying she wanted Austin over and over, but Lucus was the rooting interest - didn't clue in for the longest time, lol). It's starting to annoy me.
Carly wasn't a crazy, slutty bitch her first time on the show. Granted her sleeping with Bo right now is not painting her in the best light. However, consider the sources you are referencing. Victor pretty much calls any woman a bitch. Brady even said that to him today. He is a misogynistic, grumpy old man. Carly married Victor because Bo wouldn't let himself love Carly as he was grieving Hope. Bo finally admitted his feelings to Carly via a letter but of course Vic switched things up so Carly got a goodbye letter from Bo instead. When Bo and Carly realized Victor did this to them, Carly divorced Vic and started a relationship with Bo. Vic then tried to kill Bo. Who is the villain there? Check Kenny's buried alive clips to see how crazy Vivian was during the Buried Alive storyline. She is not exactly the best person to judge anyone. Lawrence was mentally ill so his opinions don't really wash either. I'm not saying Carly is perfect. She's made mistakes but she's not the villain that Victor, Vivian and Lawrence make her out to be. Would Maggie have offered to let her stay at her house if she was such a bad person? LOL! I love this post, it's making me chuckle. You are right about Victor. As funny as he is calling everyone a bitch, whore, slut or whatever his choice word of the day is, it's making him seem out of touch LOL. Also had to laugh at "Lawrence was mentally ill so his opinions don't really wash either."
Also, they haven't really explained why Vivian doesn't like Carly. So she's done some crazy things to her...but what drove her to do it? She keeps saying that Carly took Nicholas and Lawrence from her, but that appears to be referencing Carly/Lawrence's last exit on the show (1993 I assume). Even though Viv and Vic are nuts, their comments about Carly still seem out there having seen what I have of Carly.
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Kenny
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Jan 12 2010, 01:43 AM
Post #91
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- cassie1013
- Jan 12 2010, 01:35 AM
Also, they haven't really explained why Vivian doesn't like Carly. So she's done some crazy things to her...but what drove her to do it? She keeps saying that Carly took Nicholas and Lawrence from her, but that appears to be referencing Carly/Lawrence's last exit on the show (1993 I assume). Even though Viv and Vic are nuts, their comments about Carly still seem out there having seen what I have of Carly. Their comments are out there because Carly isn't how they describe her to be.
If I'm not mistaken, Victor and Carly were on decent terms when she originally left Salem, so I don't really understand why he's suddenly so hellbent on bringing her down. If he wanted so badly to destroy her, wouldn't he have done it years ago when she "had her hooks in Bo" even more? The writers don't seem to enjoy writing for those of us who've been watching the show for 15+ years though, so I guess history doesn't matter.
Also, I see Victor and Vivian as two different types of "villains." Victor is a ruthless asshole whereas Vivian can be quite twisted and psychotic. I don't see him wanting to go along with her plan (if it's really as dark as promised) no matter how much he loathes Carly Manning. So yeah, the whole Victor angle could use a little more explaining. JMO though.
As for Vivian, she always had this weird semi-incestuous relationship with Lawrence and she hated Carly because she "took" him and Nikki away from her. If you watch the clip of her plucking off the flower petals and rolling around on Carly's grave, you can hear her whispering "I love you Lawrence" and giving the camera "fuck me" orgasm eyes as she writhes around in the dirt, LoL. Her whole relationship with Lawrence was just creepy and weird. She would've fucked him if she could've, LoL. Her hatred of Carly stems from her unhealthy closeness with Lawrence.
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duckie
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Jan 12 2010, 01:52 AM
Post #92
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- cassie1013
- Jan 12 2010, 01:35 AM
Also, they haven't really explained why Vivian doesn't like Carly. So she's done some crazy things to her...but what drove her to do it? She keeps saying that Carly took Nicholas and Lawrence from her, but that appears to be referencing Carly/Lawrence's last exit on the show (1993 I assume). Even though Viv and Vic are nuts, their comments about Carly still seem out there having seen what I have of Carly.
Carly and Lawrence were originally betrothed from birth, back when Carly was known as Katarina von Leuschner. Katarina did not want to be in a loveless marriage so she left boarding school, changed her name, and essentially disappeared. However, she did meet Lawrence, who was using the name James, and they fell in love. Vivian did not think that Carly/Katarina was good enough for her precious Lawrence, and she made sure that Carly found out who James really was. She also told her that Lawrence/James was only out for her money. Carly was devastated and ran away. However, she later found out that she was pregnant with Lawrence's child. She went back to Vivian, who she thought was her friend, for help in handling the pregnancy.
Vivian helped Carly through the pregnancy, but when Carly went into labor, the doctor sedated her. When she came to, the doctor and Vivian told her that the baby had died. Of course, Carly never held the baby, and she believed their story. Eight years later, Vivian came to Salem to live with Lawrence, bringing along a child she had allegedly adopted from a woman in France. Of course, this was Nicholas, Carly and Lawrence's child.
Eventually, Carly and Lawrence learned of Vivian's deception and got their son back. Vivian blamed Carly most of all because she had always been very close to Lawrence. Their relationship had bordered on incestuous at times. So, she hatched a plot to frame Carly for the murder of some of her patients - one of which was going to be Caroline Brady. It was when Vivian attempted to kill Caroline that Carly (who was under suspicion for the deaths of the patients) caught her and got into a physical struggle with her. Carly wound up being injected with the solution that Caroline was to get, and it put her in a coma. Vivian then gave her certain herbs to simulate death. When she "died," Vivian had her buried alive with enough air and water so that she could torture her for a while. Ultimately, she confessed to Lawrence what she had done, and Lawrence rescued Carly. However, he was disgusted with Vivian and their relationship was destroyed.
I think the reasons Vivian doesn't like Carly are pretty clear. She didn't think Carly was good enough for her nephew, and she had a strange affinity for him. Furthermore, Carly took away the child that she had raised as her own for 8 years - even though that child wasn't hers to begin with. They may not be logical, but nothing Vivian does is particularly logical.
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dc cubs
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Jan 12 2010, 01:52 AM
Post #93
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- Kenny
- Jan 12 2010, 01:43 AM
- cassie1013
- Jan 12 2010, 01:35 AM
Also, they haven't really explained why Vivian doesn't like Carly. So she's done some crazy things to her...but what drove her to do it? She keeps saying that Carly took Nicholas and Lawrence from her, but that appears to be referencing Carly/Lawrence's last exit on the show (1993 I assume). Even though Viv and Vic are nuts, their comments about Carly still seem out there having seen what I have of Carly.
Their comments are out there because Carly isn't how they describe her to be. If I'm not mistaken, Victor and Carly were on decent terms when she originally left Salem, so I don't really understand why he's suddenly so hellbent on bringing her down. If he wanted so badly to destroy her, wouldn't he have done it years ago when she "had her hooks in Bo" even more? The writers don't seem to enjoy writing for those of us who've been watching the show for 15+ years though, so I guess history doesn't matter. Also, I see Victor and Vivian as two different types of "villains." Victor is a ruthless asshole whereas Vivian can be quite twisted and psychotic. I don't see him wanting to along with her plan (if it's really as dark as promised) no matter how much he loathes Carly Manning. So yeah, the whole Victor angle could use a little more explaining. JMO though. As for Vivian, she always had this weird semi-incestuous relationship with Lawrence and she hated that Carly "took" him from her. If you watch the clip of her rolling around on Carly's grave, you can hear her whispering "I love you Lawrence" and giving the camera "fuck me" orgasm eyes as she writhes around in the dirt, LoL. Her whole relationship with Lawrence was just creepy and borderline incestuous. She would've fucked him if she couldn've, LoL. Her hatred of Carly stems from her unhealthy closeness with Lawrence. Kenny, I think you're correct that Victor and Carly were on decent terms when she left Salem. I believe when Isabella died a truce was formed between Victor and Bo/Carly to honor her memory.
The Vivian and Lawrence relationship was borderline incestuous. It creeped me out. Vivian had a very unhealthy attachment to her nephew. When Lawrence and Carly left Salem he could not forgive her for burying Carly alive. They have not said if Vivian and Lawrence ever worked things out after they left town.
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PhoenixRising05
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Jan 12 2010, 01:56 AM
Post #94
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Victor and Carly were civil but I think Victor was trying so hard to change for Isabella (who was friends with Carly) and was also making attempts at a relationship with Bo (once again, thanks to Isabella) that he put aside his hatred for her. This was the beginning of Victor becoming a shell of himself as he became way too soft. Victor and Carly never really resolved anything so I have no issue with him reacting this way.
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cassie1013
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Jan 12 2010, 01:58 AM
Post #95
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I get that Vivian and Lawrence had an oddly close relationship, but did that mean she wanted him to be single forever? LoL. Or maybe the real question is: did she want to marry him? Sick!
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Kenny
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Jan 12 2010, 02:02 AM
Post #96
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- dc cubs
- Jan 12 2010, 01:52 AM
They have not said if Vivian and Lawrence ever worked things out after they left town. Vivian made a comment recently about how she and Lawrence didn't have the best relationship for many years, but she still loved him enough to avenge his death.
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Red Mist
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Jan 12 2010, 07:21 AM
Post #97
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- Matt
- Jan 12 2010, 12:41 AM
More and more (especially after seeing Ari nearly strangled by the long, stringy hide of a muppet today) I'm wondering whether the costume designer found an amazing clearance sale on scarves somewhere. You could play a drinking game with DAYS and scarves. Of course, some days you'd be drunk before the show was over. The use of scarves almost boarders on performance art. Oh. Wait. "Performance Art" is another daytime show. :P LOL Matt, I think someone has been getting scarves made by their granny for years and finally decided to put them to good use.
Oh, Granny, the great muppet killer, whoa to you.
Now I know why I quit seeing Harry Monster on Sesame Street...
Edited by Red Mist, Jan 12 2010, 07:23 AM.
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karmakatch63
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Jan 12 2010, 08:09 AM
Post #98
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- cassie1013
- Jan 12 2010, 01:58 AM
I get that Vivian and Lawrence had an oddly close relationship, but did that mean she wanted him to be single forever? LoL. Or maybe the real question is: did she want to marry him? Sick! Viv is a sicko, and she plays it to the hilt. Seriously, what sane person chases down an adult to tell him she loves him and that he is her son, when he and everyone else know the only connection to him is that she stole him as an embryo and tried to kill his mother. When she reminds him, "I carried you in my tummy" I wonder how JKJ can keep a straight face. Viv's comment that "now Carly will know how it is to lose someone she loves" is pretty bizarre in that she kidnapped Carly's first child and Carly felt the loss of that baby for ten years. Adds to her sicko insanity that she actually think she has a right to punish anyone for anything.
Vic's classic line of hypocrisy (Monday's eppy) was "She tried to kill me...." referencing Nicole to Brady. He said it with such shock that anyone in his family could get past that. Considering Vic was quite willing to off his son Bo to own Carly for himself, and Bo and the entire Brady family never blinks an eye about that, I have to wonder. Are the writers expecting us to continue to pretend Vic is all about family???
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Harmony233
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Jan 12 2010, 08:54 AM
Post #99
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- cassie1013
- Jan 12 2010, 01:58 AM
I get that Vivian and Lawrence had an oddly close relationship, but did that mean she wanted him to be single forever? LoL. Or maybe the real question is: did she want to marry him? Sick! Vivians jealousy of Lawrences obession and love for Carly it always seemed more that of a lover.Actually Viv's scheme of burying Carly alive is what really brought Carly and Lawrence back together.Before that Carly was in love with Bo.On he other hand Lawrence was never sane either.I mean he was evil to everyone in town it was just Carly that he was never evil too back then.
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six
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Jan 12 2010, 09:38 AM
Post #100
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- dc cubs
- Jan 12 2010, 01:22 AM
- cassie1013
- Jan 12 2010, 12:56 AM
The only problem I see with this Carly story is a lot is revolving around her right now, but I feel like when Carly is actually on screen she doesn't deliver to the expectations of how other characters describe her. I don't want to say she falls flat, but she kind of does. Vivian, Victor and flashback-Lawrence make her sound like some crazy, slutty bitch but she's not really. It was these sorts of storylines that confused me when I was younger (like Sami saying she wanted Austin over and over, but Lucus was the rooting interest - didn't clue in for the longest time, lol). It's starting to annoy me.
Carly wasn't a crazy, slutty bitch her first time on the show. Granted her sleeping with Bo right now is not painting her in the best light. However, consider the sources you are referencing. Victor pretty much calls any woman a bitch. Brady even said that to him today. He is a misogynistic, grumpy old man. Carly married Victor because Bo wouldn't let himself love Carly as he was grieving Hope. Bo finally admitted his feelings to Carly via a letter but of course Vic switched things up so Carly got a goodbye letter from Bo instead. When Bo and Carly realized Victor did this to them, Carly divorced Vic and started a relationship with Bo. Vic then tried to kill Bo. Who is the villain there? Check Kenny's buried alive clips to see how crazy Vivian was during the Buried Alive storyline. She is not exactly the best person to judge anyone. Lawrence was mentally ill so his opinions don't really wash either. I'm not saying Carly is perfect. She's made mistakes but she's not the villain that Victor, Vivian and Lawrence make her out to be. Would Maggie have offered to let her stay at her house if she was such a bad person? I wish the show had aired more Vivian clips outside of Carly's perspective to explain the sort of person Vivian is. I was only familiar with the cartoonish Viv, and had to sort of reset my views on her, even knowing she buried Carly alive, because like Cassie, I figured at first that Vivian's issues with Carly might have a basis in reality, and that she just took things way overboard in classic soap style. What made me realize just how insane Vivian was, was a Viv/Lawrence clip, where she taunted/manipulated him into saying he'd murdered his brother, even though he was only five when it happened. If she'd do that to someone she claimed to love, it's easy to believe that Carly really is a good person who just ended up marrying into the wrong family.
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