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Monday, December 17th Daily Discussion
Topic Started: Dec 13 2012, 02:28 PM (6,490 Views)
onceinalifetime
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esp13
Dec 14 2012, 05:02 PM


Quote:
 
I apologize. I meant "fairly quickly" in Days days, not real time. I seem to recall there were like one or two dates per side and then it was done. Nonetheless, I stand corrected.

And, honestly, I don't really care that Daniel wasn't sensitive to poor Jack. Daniel didn't know Jack, wasn't his friend, and didn't owe him anything. Daniel didn't go after Jack, didn't submarine him, didn't play dirty. He did absolutely nothing to Jack. The only person who owed Jack anything was Jennifer.
I think Daniel owed Jack the common decency to step aside when he found out what happened to Jack. Daniel knew that Jack still loved Jennifer, they shared two children together, and Jennifer was "torn" between the two of them, which meant she still had feelings for Jack. A decent guy would not have tried to break up a family. But then Daniel didn't do the decent thing because he's not a decent guy, no matter how many people in Salem have forgotten the slimy things he has done.
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concerned
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onceinalifetime
Dec 14 2012, 05:46 PM
esp13
Dec 14 2012, 05:02 PM


Quote:
 
I apologize. I meant "fairly quickly" in Days days, not real time. I seem to recall there were like one or two dates per side and then it was done. Nonetheless, I stand corrected.

And, honestly, I don't really care that Daniel wasn't sensitive to poor Jack. Daniel didn't know Jack, wasn't his friend, and didn't owe him anything. Daniel didn't go after Jack, didn't submarine him, didn't play dirty. He did absolutely nothing to Jack. The only person who owed Jack anything was Jennifer.
I think Daniel owed Jack the common decency to step aside when he found out what happened to Jack. Daniel knew that Jack still loved Jennifer, they shared two children together, and Jennifer was "torn" between the two of them, which meant she still had feelings for Jack. A decent guy would not have tried to break up a family. But then Daniel didn't do the decent thing because he's not a decent guy, no matter how many people in Salem have forgotten the slimy things he has done.
Just because you are a Dr and "save lives" that doesn't automatically mean you are a great guy.
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Honeybees
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concerned
Dec 14 2012, 06:33 PM
onceinalifetime
Dec 14 2012, 05:46 PM
esp13
Dec 14 2012, 05:02 PM


Quote:
 
I apologize. I meant "fairly quickly" in Days days, not real time. I seem to recall there were like one or two dates per side and then it was done. Nonetheless, I stand corrected.

And, honestly, I don't really care that Daniel wasn't sensitive to poor Jack. Daniel didn't know Jack, wasn't his friend, and didn't owe him anything. Daniel didn't go after Jack, didn't submarine him, didn't play dirty. He did absolutely nothing to Jack. The only person who owed Jack anything was Jennifer.
I think Daniel owed Jack the common decency to step aside when he found out what happened to Jack. Daniel knew that Jack still loved Jennifer, they shared two children together, and Jennifer was "torn" between the two of them, which meant she still had feelings for Jack. A decent guy would not have tried to break up a family. But then Daniel didn't do the decent thing because he's not a decent guy, no matter how many people in Salem have forgotten the slimy things he has done.
Just because you are a Dr and "save lives" that doesn't automatically mean you are a great guy.
Plenty of doctors who save lots of lives are raging assholes. And saving lives is Daniel's job, anyway. Doing your job doesn't mean you have awesome character. It means you are doing your job. Plus, Daniel regularly violates the ethics of his profession in, oh let me count the ways.

I don't even hate Daniel as much as others. But I hate that he's around and Jack isn't. Dumb. Dumb. Dumb producers.
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DayDreamer
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Fan of EJ+ABBY!

I can't believe that Rafe is considered as a "better" person than EJ. He is guilt tripping anyone that does not do as he wants things. They way he is guilt tripping Sami is disgusting ,.. accordingly to my view.
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lysie
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Hologram
Dec 16 2012, 12:35 PM
I can't believe that Rafe is considered as a "better" person than EJ. He is guilt tripping anyone that does not do as he wants things. They way he is guilt tripping Sami is disgusting ,.. accordingly to my view.
Yeah. Guilt tripping is totally comparable to things EJ has done.
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blueskies
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lysie
Dec 16 2012, 12:37 PM
Hologram
Dec 16 2012, 12:35 PM
I can't believe that Rafe is considered as a "better" person than EJ. He is guilt tripping anyone that does not do as he wants things. They way he is guilt tripping Sami is disgusting ,.. accordingly to my view.
Yeah. Guilt tripping is totally comparable to things EJ has done.
:laugh:
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Honeybees
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Hologram
Dec 16 2012, 12:35 PM
I can't believe that Rafe is considered as a "better" person than EJ. He is guilt tripping anyone that does not do as he wants things. They way he is guilt tripping Sami is disgusting ,.. accordingly to my view.
Let us not forget his creepy, controlling interest in his baby sister's reproductive choices. He frigging used his police badge to bust into an abortion clinic to stop his sister from getting an abortion (something he should have be fired from the force for doing, and could very well have gotten him shot by security).

Brothers can be interested in their sisters' lives. They just shouldn't be able to control their little sisters' lives and choices. Rafe hasn't come off as caring, but as furious that he's not the one making Gabi's choices for her.

The writing for the character, whom I assume the writers want us to like, is bewildering. EJ is supposed to be a villain, and he does villainous things so it's not really fair to compare the two, but Rafe does a lot of un-heroic things.
Edited by Honeybees, Dec 16 2012, 12:47 PM.
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magicsteacher
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Honeybees
Dec 16 2012, 12:41 PM
Hologram
Dec 16 2012, 12:35 PM
I can't believe that Rafe is considered as a "better" person than EJ. He is guilt tripping anyone that does not do as he wants things. They way he is guilt tripping Sami is disgusting ,.. accordingly to my view.
Let us not forget his creepy, controlling interest in his baby sister's reproductive choices. He frigging used his police badge to bust into an abortion clinic to stop his sister from getting an abortion (something he should have be fired from the force for doing, and could very well have gotten him shot by security).

Brothers can be interested in their sisters' lives. They just shouldn't be able to control their little sisters' lives and choices. Rafe hasn't come off as caring, but as furious that he's not the one making Gabi's choices for her.

The writing for the character, whom I assume the writers want us to like, is bewildering. EJ is supposed to be a villain, and he does villainous things so it's not really fair to compare the two, but Rafe does a lot of un-heroic things.
I don't recall Rafe using his badge to break into the abortion clinic; he and Sami walked in the front door together. He tried to get into the room where Gabi was by telling them he was a cop, but he didn't try to physically break down a door or anything.

As far as guilt tripping goes, I would say Sami is the one doing a good job of that by shoving the trust thing in Rafe's face every chance she gets- nice,since she is the one who had griefsex when she was married. And oh yeah, he forgave her for that.
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blueskies
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Honeybees
Dec 16 2012, 12:41 PM
Hologram
Dec 16 2012, 12:35 PM
I can't believe that Rafe is considered as a "better" person than EJ. He is guilt tripping anyone that does not do as he wants things. They way he is guilt tripping Sami is disgusting ,.. accordingly to my view.
Let us not forget his creepy, controlling interest in his baby sister's reproductive choices. He frigging used his police badge to bust into an abortion clinic to stop his sister from getting an abortion (something he should have be fired from the force for doing, and could very well have gotten him shot by security).

Brothers can be interested in their sisters' lives. They just shouldn't be able to control their little sisters' lives and choices. Rafe hasn't come off as caring, but as furious that he's not the one making Gabi's choices for her.

The writing for the character, whom I assume the writers want us to like, is bewildering. EJ is supposed to be a villain, and he does villainous things so it's not really fair to compare the two, but Rafe does a lot of un-heroic things.
Rafe is more like s father than a brother to Gabi. And I can pretty much guarantee you that if it had been a 19-yr old Ciara, or Belle, their fathers would have done the same thing on this show. Especially Bo.
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Daysdegrassi
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onceinalifetime
Dec 14 2012, 05:46 PM
esp13
Dec 14 2012, 05:02 PM


Quote:
 
I apologize. I meant "fairly quickly" in Days days, not real time. I seem to recall there were like one or two dates per side and then it was done. Nonetheless, I stand corrected.

And, honestly, I don't really care that Daniel wasn't sensitive to poor Jack. Daniel didn't know Jack, wasn't his friend, and didn't owe him anything. Daniel didn't go after Jack, didn't submarine him, didn't play dirty. He did absolutely nothing to Jack. The only person who owed Jack anything was Jennifer.
I think Daniel owed Jack the common decency to step aside when he found out what happened to Jack. Daniel knew that Jack still loved Jennifer, they shared two children together, and Jennifer was "torn" between the two of them, which meant she still had feelings for Jack. A decent guy would not have tried to break up a family. But then Daniel didn't do the decent thing because he's not a decent guy, no matter how many people in Salem have forgotten the slimy things he has done.
I disagree. Sure, we're sick of Daniel, but he deserves credit for dumping Jennifuck and leaving town so J&J can reunite. However, I can see being mad at him for the reason why he did this. He did it because he was tired of waiting for her, not because it was the right thing to do.
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Southofsoap
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Seeing Kate made me realize how much I love her. Didn't appreciate the Daniel pimping though.

Feb sweeps prediction: Daniel is revealed to be the Messiah. It will be a non-event sweeps again though, since this revelation will require no behaviour modification by the citizens of Salem regarding Daniel...
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blueskies
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Southofsoap
Dec 17 2012, 03:46 PM
Seeing Kate made me realize how much I love her. Didn't appreciate the Daniel pimping though.

Feb sweeps prediction: Daniel is revealed to be the Messiah. It will be a non-event sweeps again though, since this revelation will require no behaviour modification by the citizens of Salem regarding Daniel...
So this means he's crucified then come Easter, yes? I could accept that, except I couldn't take the worship following his resurrection.
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Evan
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Just when I think the Dannifer pimping can't get any more nauseatingly bad, I'm proved wrong. :soapbox:
Jennifer, you tramp, you're welcome to Dr I Bang My Female Patients, you were never worthy of Jack's love, and it's insulting to Jack's memory that you'd think for an instant that he'd approve of Daniel taking over from him as Jen's husband & Abby's father.
What's next? Jack Jnr comes to Salem, and joins the "Daniel Worship" cheerleading team?
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jb1183


onceinalifetime
Dec 14 2012, 05:46 PM
esp13
Dec 14 2012, 05:02 PM


Quote:
 
I apologize. I meant "fairly quickly" in Days days, not real time. I seem to recall there were like one or two dates per side and then it was done. Nonetheless, I stand corrected.

And, honestly, I don't really care that Daniel wasn't sensitive to poor Jack. Daniel didn't know Jack, wasn't his friend, and didn't owe him anything. Daniel didn't go after Jack, didn't submarine him, didn't play dirty. He did absolutely nothing to Jack. The only person who owed Jack anything was Jennifer.
I think Daniel owed Jack the common decency to step aside when he found out what happened to Jack. Daniel knew that Jack still loved Jennifer, they shared two children together, and Jennifer was "torn" between the two of them, which meant she still had feelings for Jack. A decent guy would not have tried to break up a family. But then Daniel didn't do the decent thing because he's not a decent guy, no matter how many people in Salem have forgotten the slimy things he has done.
Perfectly stated. It wasn't about "owing" Jack anything. It was about decency. Once Daniel knew the full story of what happened to Jack and that he didn't actually abandon Jennifer, he should have immediately stepped aside and encouraged Jennifer and Abigail to think more rationally about the situation. Instead he fed their misplaced anger at Jack and refused to back down from pursuing Jen. It doesn't matter that Jack and Jen were already divorced-Jen divorced him based on what was ultimately false information. Once the full story was known, Daniel should have encouraged a reconciliation-instead he put a man who had just been tortured for a year in the position of having to "compete" for his own wife. Jen, Abigail, and Daniel all share responsibility for their shocking lack of empathy toward Jack and the horrible situation he endured.
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bomber
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Evan
Dec 17 2012, 05:12 PM
Just when I think the Dannifer pimping can't get any more nauseatingly bad, I'm proved wrong. :soapbox:
Jennifer, you tramp, you're welcome to Dr I Bang My Female Patients, you were never worthy of Jack's love, and it's insulting to Jack's memory that you'd think for an instant that he'd approve of Daniel taking over from him as Jen's husband & Abby's father.
What's next? Jack Jnr comes to Salem, and joins the "Daniel Worship" cheerleading team?
This "Jack would have wanted her to move on" chorus really gets on my nerves. Jack never felt he was good enough for Jen but that's not the same as him wanting her to move on from him at lightning speed. While it's true he tried to set her up with Brian, this was because she was pregnant and he wanted someone to look after her and Frankie because he wanted to protect Jen from Patrick. In this case Jen is supposed to be a stable (?), middle-aged woman with no young children to care for. I think he would be very hurt at how quickly Jen and Abby have joined the Tan bandwagon, especially given the circumstances of his death.
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DrewHamilton
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I always love Hope and Rafe scenes. I enjoy their friendship, and I hope it continues to be shown. I always like Rafe turning to Hope (and Bo when he was on the show) for guidance. And then I also always enjoyed them working together. Since Bo's no longer going to be seen, Hope is going to need a new partner at work. I hope Rafe is that replacement.

I liked the little hint of a controlling side when it comes to Sonny that we got today. I want to see Sonny starting to embrace his Kiriakis roots. Hell, he has controlling genes on both sides of the family if you take Grandpa Duke Johnson into consideration.

Oh that's right, Kate is a cancer survivor. Nice recall. It's nice to see the warm side of Kate every now and then. She doesn't have to be cold all the time. I didn't see anything regarding Kate's scenes with Daniel as pimping him. Definitely entering the next phase of the story with the mention of Chloe and Philip not being together. Subtlety isn't really Tomlin/Whitesell's thing.

It was nice seeing Jennifer reflect on her life with Jack while looking at the photo album. I would've liked some flashbacks, but whatever. Closing the book and placing it in the drawer was definitely an indication that Jennifer is ready to move on with her life. Jack's been gone for four months now. Too soon in real life. Maybe even too soon in soap opera life, but I've seen a lot worse.
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LonePirate
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Was Rafe wearing purple pants today? I don't know how to process that.

While some of the Gabi and Nick scenes have bored me, their scenes on the bench today were as good as anything they have given us so far. I don't particularly like either character; but their relationship\coupling sort of works for me.

I did enjoy Sonny telling both Will and Sami, in his own way, his dislike of and disinterest in the wedding. It's nice when someone speaks out against the craziness sometimes.

However, I did not like Kate pushing Parker (and Jennifer) with Daniel. I'm sure that end scene between Dan and Jen was exceptionally boring so I FFed through it and I do not care what was said.
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michr544125


Minus Jen/Daniel the show was fairly good today.

I quite like the baby story but hate how Will and Sonny are being written as best friends vs. boyfriends. The writing is so damn vanilla for them. It's not their lack of chemistry. It is the fact that ever sine their steamy love scene they have written them as though the love scene never happened...that is minus the scarf scene the other day. There is a major difference with the way Nick and Gabi are being written vs. Will and Sonny and I think it's terrible. I did enjoy Nick and Gabi today but made me hate even more how Will and Sonny aren't being written for as a couple. I am all for a good story but the story is hard to root for when Will and Sonny's romance is being pushed to the non existent. I should be wanting to root for Wilson and Nabi but I find myself rooting for nobody right now.

But did enjoy Sonny telling Sami "hell no" to being an usher.

Again I ask why isn't Abby the center of the younger set instead of Gabi? Kate Mansi is a great actress.
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Will&Sonny


DrewHamilton
Dec 17 2012, 06:26 PM
Oh that's right, Kate is a cancer survivor. Nice recall. It's nice to see the warm side of Kate every now and then. She doesn't have to be cold all the time. I didn't see anything regarding Kate's scenes with Daniel as pimping him. Definitely entering the next phase of the story with the mention of Chloe and Philip not being together. Subtlety isn't really Tomlin/Whitesell's thing.
Re: the bolded...did Kate actually say that? Because I didn't hear anything about Chloe and Philip's relationship -- or lack thereof -- during the episode that I watched. I know that it was in spoilers that were posted elsewhere on this site, but as far as I can tell, it was either cut, was never in the episode to begin with, or is actually in a different episode that has not yet aired.
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JessicaLeigh
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Did anyone catch Sami's facial expression in the background when Nick revealed to Rafe and Hope that he and Gabi "got together a lot sooner than everyone thought"? She was visibly disgusted, lip curled up, side-eying them, the whole bit. Sami Brady, please. You move your ex-husbands/baby daddies around like musical chairs and you have the nerve to judge the breakneck speed at which other people fall into bed? Hilarious.
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