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Nick's true motives revealed; Airs week of March 4
Topic Started: Feb 26 2013, 09:38 PM (11,079 Views)
cord08


LonePirate
Feb 27 2013, 11:00 AM
If Nick wasn't a homophobe, I would be cheering for him to con, blackmail or do whatever it takes to be a father to this kid. Will may be the biological father but he has not shown a fraction of the desire to be the baby's father that Nick has shown. In Salem, it's a winner take all battle to the death in custody disputes and Will simply is not a worthy competitor who is up to the challenge. Until he grows a spine and starts fighting for his daughter, I am not convinced she would be better off with him than with Nick. For me, the only person in this mess with the potential to be a good father is Sonny. Nick and Will bring their own sets of unique problems that make both of them bad prospects for fatherhood.
I hate to say it because I generally like Will, but I agree. At this point, dumbing down Will even farther isn't helping this story. It's making it harder to root for anyone.
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MericP
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I was TeamNick at the start of this storyline but it is difficult to believe that they'll actually allow him to raise a child if he is being written the way he is.

Otherwise I'd say go for it since Will sucks.
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Angelsmile


Will signing away his rights makes no sense. Nick can't take him to court, Gabi has to do that and Nick would have to convince her so he definitely had time before signing. Even if Nick told the cops and played the tape there would be no guarantee of an investigation or prosecution let alone conviction and jail. Without all of these steps Nick does not have a leg to stand on in civil court. In the scheme of things even in a civil court a judge would still be deciding between a muderer with illegally obtained and possibly faked evidence and a confused traumatised 14 year old who may or may not have tried to shoot someone. It's pretty much a toss up. It would have made more sense to see if anything would come of Nick's threats than to immediately give in. It is yet more of the passive, naive, and weak Will. It seems like whenever he has to do more than cry or complain over something he just folds. I am not sure he should have the baby, if he can't man up for her now then when. I find it funny that the article says that Sonny has to tell Will that the reason Nick doesn't want him around the baby is because he is gay. Then Will has to actually go ask? Nick has called him gayboy to his face and told him the baby shouldn't be confused by having three daddies and someone had to tell Will he's a homophobe? Further after Nick admits his reason Will becomes concerned and realizes Nick can be a jerk? Nick exudes crazy and Will hasn't been concerned before? Nick being a jerk wasn't clear to him when he was calling him gayboy, trying to keep him from being a part of the baby's life, or when he blakcmailed him? I have the hardest time not damaging my television when watching Will onscreen and it seems it will only get worse.

As far as Sonny telling Will what he knows, while I think he should at least be conflicted by it, it really serves no useful pupose other than to possibly get Chad in legal trouble and give Will a reason not to like Gabi. Nick realized he had to get proof and he would know the same about any threat to Gabi. Andrew is dead and the only people that know all of the details, and not just that Gabi did something bad, are Chad (who legally can't tell), Justin (who legally can't tell), Melanie (who is gone), and Sonny (who got his information from Chad which to some extent makes it heresay). Will and Sonny could use the information to scare Nick and Gabi in terms of having everyone in town know what she is really capable of, but that is the most trouble they can threaten with what they have and without proof they could actually have legal consequences for spreading the information.

In any case I agree with others. Where is Will's backbone? Why would he sign over his rights without any kind of a fight? It's hard to be on a character's side when even he won't stand up for him.
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esp13
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Really? They let EJ raise a child despite how he has "acted" in the past. Sami gets to raise her children. Lexie did all sorts of bad things when she was trying to keep Zach, but she got to raise Theo. I realize Nick isn't the biological father, but since I don't believe that biology is everything, that doesn't much matter to me.

I'm with the poster above who said that if Nick was a homophobe, I'd be totally team Nick. And I like Will. But I hate Sami and it's hard to root for any scenario where I have to be on her side about anything. If Will stood up on his own and didn't let his mother influence him, I'd be much more likely to be completely on his side. As it is, the best I can hope for is that Nick gets taken down, Will tells Sami to take a hike, Gabi gets a brain, and Will and Gabi figure out how to co-parent their child.
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Angelsmile


WillFan
Feb 27 2013, 10:06 AM
Will could sign away his rights but it will not matter because a person has so many months(I thinking three months) after the baby is baby to change their mind.Like when a baby is put up for adoption by its parents after the baby is born even if the baby is adopt,the bio parents have a few months to change their minds.
Will signing away his rights means nothing mainly because he has proof that he was blackmailed into doing it. No agreement signed under coercion is legally binding.
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esp13
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Angelsmile
Feb 27 2013, 11:36 AM
WillFan
Feb 27 2013, 10:06 AM
Will could sign away his rights but it will not matter because a person has so many months(I thinking three months) after the baby is baby to change their mind.Like when a baby is put up for adoption by its parents after the baby is born even if the baby is adopt,the bio parents have a few months to change their minds.
Will signing away his rights means nothing mainly because he has proof that he was blackmailed into doing it. No agreement signed under coercion is legally binding.
That might be true (although the popular perception of coercion and the legal definition aren't always the same) but the only way to prove he was coerced is to reveal that he shot EJ and Nick blackmailed him. That's not exactly a good scenario.
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Angelsmile


LonePirate
Feb 27 2013, 11:00 AM
If Nick wasn't a homophobe, I would be cheering for him to con, blackmail or do whatever it takes to be a father to this kid. Will may be the biological father but he has not shown a fraction of the desire to be the baby's father that Nick has shown. In Salem, it's a winner take all battle to the death in custody disputes and Will simply is not a worthy competitor who is up to the challenge. Until he grows a spine and starts fighting for his daughter, I am not convinced she would be better off with him than with Nick. For me, the only person in this mess with the potential to be a good father is Sonny. Nick and Will bring their own sets of unique problems that make both of them bad prospects for fatherhood.
I love this post like nobody's business. :wub2:
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LuvingLumi
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♥ LUMI ♥

esp13
Feb 27 2013, 11:33 AM
Really? They let EJ raise a child despite how he has "acted" in the past. Sami gets to raise her children. Lexie did all sorts of bad things when she was trying to keep Zach, but she got to raise Theo. I realize Nick isn't the biological father, but since I don't believe that biology is everything, that doesn't much matter to me.

I'm with the poster above who said that if Nick was a homophobe, I'd be totally team Nick. And I like Will. But I hate Sami and it's hard to root for any scenario where I have to be on her side about anything. If Will stood up on his own and didn't let his mother influence him, I'd be much more likely to be completely on his side. As it is, the best I can hope for is that Nick gets taken down, Will tells Sami to take a hike, Gabi gets a brain, and Will and Gabi figure out how to co-parent their child.
Will needs to think about himself here and tell his mother to butt out. It's HIS child, not hers...and although she apparently means well, it still should be HIS fight to fight. I'd have much more respect for Will if he kicked up the crazy and didn't fear Nick on this....get advice from his parents but keep them at an arm's length when it comes to dealing with HIS child and the rights he has to said child. I just feel that they are writing Will as far too weak for my liking...never thought he'd grow up to be such a wuss.
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JessicaLeigh
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LonePirate
Feb 27 2013, 11:00 AM
If Nick wasn't a homophobe, I would be cheering for him to con, blackmail or do whatever it takes to be a father to this kid. Will may be the biological father but he has not shown a fraction of the desire to be the baby's father that Nick has shown. In Salem, it's a winner take all battle to the death in custody disputes and Will simply is not a worthy competitor who is up to the challenge. Until he grows a spine and starts fighting for his daughter, I am not convinced she would be better off with him than with Nick. For me, the only person in this mess with the potential to be a good father is Sonny. Nick and Will bring their own sets of unique problems that make both of them bad prospects for fatherhood.
I can't say I agree with this viewpoint entirely but I definitely have some sympathy for it. I keep analyzing where Will's head could be at in an effort to conjure up more empathy, but I just don't particularly care for him right now. Lately, I felt he was strongest when he stood up to Sami at the hospital. I felt his love and concern for his daughter then. I want to see more of that Will, and not just when he's parenting his own mother. I keep thinking 'it's coming, it's coming...' but I'm not so sure.
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cord08


esp13
Feb 27 2013, 11:39 AM
Angelsmile
Feb 27 2013, 11:36 AM
WillFan
Feb 27 2013, 10:06 AM
Will could sign away his rights but it will not matter because a person has so many months(I thinking three months) after the baby is baby to change their mind.Like when a baby is put up for adoption by its parents after the baby is born even if the baby is adopt,the bio parents have a few months to change their minds.
Will signing away his rights means nothing mainly because he has proof that he was blackmailed into doing it. No agreement signed under coercion is legally binding.
That might be true (although the popular perception of coercion and the legal definition aren't always the same) but the only way to prove he was coerced is to reveal that he shot EJ and Nick blackmailed him. That's not exactly a good scenario.
It's obvious to me that Will, and probably Gabi, will end up with custody in the end. I just hate the fact that Will signs over his rights in the first place. Now his has been willing to give up his baby not once, but twice. I don't care if he was coerced, it still looks bad.
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Pookie
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esp13
Feb 27 2013, 11:39 AM
Angelsmile
Feb 27 2013, 11:36 AM
WillFan
Feb 27 2013, 10:06 AM
Will could sign away his rights but it will not matter because a person has so many months(I thinking three months) after the baby is baby to change their mind.Like when a baby is put up for adoption by its parents after the baby is born even if the baby is adopt,the bio parents have a few months to change their minds.
Will signing away his rights means nothing mainly because he has proof that he was blackmailed into doing it. No agreement signed under coercion is legally binding.
That might be true (although the popular perception of coercion and the legal definition aren't always the same) but the only way to prove he was coerced is to reveal that he shot EJ and Nick blackmailed him. That's not exactly a good scenario.
Well, there might be a way that Will, EJ and Lucas an get their legal ducks in a row and do just that. PLUS, Sonny is a witness to Nick's blackmail threat. There HAS to be a way to have Will confess and NOT get thrown into jail. He was a minor, he was coerced into not turning himself in by a parent and the man he shot has NO desire to press charges. There are SO many extenuating circumstances that at the minimum, he could just get probation and only be forced to stay in Salem.

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esp13
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Pookie
Feb 27 2013, 11:52 AM
esp13
Feb 27 2013, 11:39 AM
Angelsmile
Feb 27 2013, 11:36 AM
WillFan
Feb 27 2013, 10:06 AM
Will could sign away his rights but it will not matter because a person has so many months(I thinking three months) after the baby is baby to change their mind.Like when a baby is put up for adoption by its parents after the baby is born even if the baby is adopt,the bio parents have a few months to change their minds.
Will signing away his rights means nothing mainly because he has proof that he was blackmailed into doing it. No agreement signed under coercion is legally binding.
That might be true (although the popular perception of coercion and the legal definition aren't always the same) but the only way to prove he was coerced is to reveal that he shot EJ and Nick blackmailed him. That's not exactly a good scenario.
Well, there might be a way that Will, EJ and Lucas an get their legal ducks in a row and do just that. PLUS, Sonny is a witness to Nick's blackmail threat. There HAS to be a way to have Will confess and NOT get thrown into jail. He was a minor, he was coerced into not turning himself in by a parent and the man he shot has NO desire to press charges. There are SO many extenuating circumstances that at the minimum, he could just get probation and only be forced to stay in Salem.

Sure, there are extenuating circumstances. Attempted murder can get you up to life in prison. I'm sure the extenuating circumstances in Will's case could get him down to 2 years or so (about half of what Nick served for murdering a scumbag while addicted to pain pills).

I continue to find it hilarious that Nick murdering Trent is the most heinous crime anyone has ever committed, but Will shooting EJ is no worse than jaywalking.
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Pookie
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cord08
Feb 27 2013, 11:48 AM
esp13
Feb 27 2013, 11:39 AM
Angelsmile
Feb 27 2013, 11:36 AM
WillFan
Feb 27 2013, 10:06 AM
Will could sign away his rights but it will not matter because a person has so many months(I thinking three months) after the baby is baby to change their mind.Like when a baby is put up for adoption by its parents after the baby is born even if the baby is adopt,the bio parents have a few months to change their minds.
Will signing away his rights means nothing mainly because he has proof that he was blackmailed into doing it. No agreement signed under coercion is legally binding.
That might be true (although the popular perception of coercion and the legal definition aren't always the same) but the only way to prove he was coerced is to reveal that he shot EJ and Nick blackmailed him. That's not exactly a good scenario.
It's obvious to me that Will, and probably Gabi, will end up with custody in the end. I just hate the fact that Will signs over his rights in the first place. Now his has been willing to give up his baby not once, but twice. I don't care if he was coerced, it still looks bad.
Maybe I'm just a softy but for ME, what it boils down to is that Will (and Gabi for that matter) are scared kids who have suddenly been thrust into VERY adult, life altering situation. Will has a HELL of a lot to work through, and I find it unrealistic and unfair to expect Will to just be able to flip a switch and suddenly become a confident bad ass.

And if you don't agree with that assessment, try looking at it from a soap opera writers stand point - they have to drag this shit out and ratchet up the twists and turns for MONTHS and MONTHS and MONTHS. This is how they're doing it.
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Angelsmile


esp13
Feb 27 2013, 11:39 AM
Angelsmile
Feb 27 2013, 11:36 AM
WillFan
Feb 27 2013, 10:06 AM
Will could sign away his rights but it will not matter because a person has so many months(I thinking three months) after the baby is baby to change their mind.Like when a baby is put up for adoption by its parents after the baby is born even if the baby is adopt,the bio parents have a few months to change their minds.
Will signing away his rights means nothing mainly because he has proof that he was blackmailed into doing it. No agreement signed under coercion is legally binding.
That might be true (although the popular perception of coercion and the legal definition aren't always the same) but the only way to prove he was coerced is to reveal that he shot EJ and Nick blackmailed him. That's not exactly a good scenario.
Actually, according to contract law blackmail is coercion. Sonny's presence is proof. As far as Will having to reveal what he did that is not necessarily true. Legally admitting what he was blackmailed with is not an admission of guilt. He could claim the recording is a fake, but he feared it would be believed. With everyone else involved willing to and having already kept silence to protect Will that would not be a hard sell. In any case, my point was that the papers are not legally binding in the first place because of the circumstances under which they were signed. I doubt this will even be the way they choose to reverse Will's signing of the papers so it really doesn't matter.
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Pookie
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esp13
Feb 27 2013, 11:58 AM
Pookie
Feb 27 2013, 11:52 AM
esp13
Feb 27 2013, 11:39 AM
Angelsmile
Feb 27 2013, 11:36 AM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
That might be true (although the popular perception of coercion and the legal definition aren't always the same) but the only way to prove he was coerced is to reveal that he shot EJ and Nick blackmailed him. That's not exactly a good scenario.
Well, there might be a way that Will, EJ and Lucas an get their legal ducks in a row and do just that. PLUS, Sonny is a witness to Nick's blackmail threat. There HAS to be a way to have Will confess and NOT get thrown into jail. He was a minor, he was coerced into not turning himself in by a parent and the man he shot has NO desire to press charges. There are SO many extenuating circumstances that at the minimum, he could just get probation and only be forced to stay in Salem.

Sure, there are extenuating circumstances. Attempted murder can get you up to life in prison. I'm sure the extenuating circumstances in Will's case could get him down to 2 years or so (about half of what Nick served for murdering a scumbag while addicted to pain pills).

I continue to find it hilarious that Nick murdering Trent is the most heinous crime anyone has ever committed, but Will shooting EJ is no worse than jaywalking.
Well, I wasn't watching when this Nick stuff happened. So my point of view is based on what I'm seeing of him now. And I not only see a homophope, I see a seriously unbalanced individual who CLEARLY hasn't worked out the issues that lead him to becoming 1) an addict 2) a creepy obessed stalker 3) a murderer.

And the fact that he's trying to convince himself and everyone that marrying Gabi and raising the baby will just "erase" all of his problems and his personal history, sends up BIG HONKIN' RED FLAGS and warning light to anyone with a brain.

So, yeah, I'm inclined to give Will more of a pass. He was a KID and he was instructed by his PARENTS to do the wrong thing. And hasn't he kept his nose clean since?
Edited by Pookie, Feb 27 2013, 12:08 PM.
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cord08


Pookie
Feb 27 2013, 11:58 AM
cord08
Feb 27 2013, 11:48 AM
esp13
Feb 27 2013, 11:39 AM
Angelsmile
Feb 27 2013, 11:36 AM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
That might be true (although the popular perception of coercion and the legal definition aren't always the same) but the only way to prove he was coerced is to reveal that he shot EJ and Nick blackmailed him. That's not exactly a good scenario.
It's obvious to me that Will, and probably Gabi, will end up with custody in the end. I just hate the fact that Will signs over his rights in the first place. Now his has been willing to give up his baby not once, but twice. I don't care if he was coerced, it still looks bad.
Maybe I'm just a softy but for ME, what it boils down to is that Will (and Gabi for that matter) are scared kids who have suddenly been thrust into VERY adult, life altering situation. Will has a HELL of a lot to work through, and I find it unrealistic and unfair to expect Will to just be able to flip a switch and suddenly become a confident bad ass.

And if you don't agree with that assessment, try looking at it from a soap opera writers stand point - they have to drag this shit out and ratchet up the twists and turns for MONTHS and MONTHS and MONTHS. This is how they're doing it.
Oh, I know why they're doing it from a soap standpoint. I still find it to be stupid, though. You can still write a soapy story if you give multiple characters a brain and a backbone. In fact, I think this story would be better if they did.

I would have more sympathy for Will if he hadn't shown some balls in the past. But he has. I want that Will back. I realize that was different writers, but still...

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esp13
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Angelsmile
Feb 27 2013, 12:03 PM
esp13
Feb 27 2013, 11:39 AM
Angelsmile
Feb 27 2013, 11:36 AM
WillFan
Feb 27 2013, 10:06 AM
Will could sign away his rights but it will not matter because a person has so many months(I thinking three months) after the baby is baby to change their mind.Like when a baby is put up for adoption by its parents after the baby is born even if the baby is adopt,the bio parents have a few months to change their minds.
Will signing away his rights means nothing mainly because he has proof that he was blackmailed into doing it. No agreement signed under coercion is legally binding.
That might be true (although the popular perception of coercion and the legal definition aren't always the same) but the only way to prove he was coerced is to reveal that he shot EJ and Nick blackmailed him. That's not exactly a good scenario.
Actually, according to contract law blackmail is coercion. Sonny's presence is proof. As far as Will having to reveal what he did that is not necessarily true. Legally admitting what he was blackmailed with is not an admission of guilt. He could claim the recording is a fake, but he feared it would be believed. With everyone else involved willing to and having already kept silence to protect Will that would not be a hard sell. In any case, my point was that the papers are not legally binding in the first place because of the circumstances under which they were signed. I doubt this will even be the way they choose to reverse Will's signing of the papers so it really doesn't matter.
Yes, blackmail is coercsion. But there is a bit of a fine line when you are talking about a criminal act as opposed to something that is simply embarassing. And sure, Will could claim that Nick's claims are untrue, but given the tape that Nick has and the number of people that know, it's not that easy. And my point is that the papers are legally binding unless Will steps up and says he was blackmailed.
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esp13
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Pookie
Feb 27 2013, 12:06 PM
esp13
Feb 27 2013, 11:58 AM
Pookie
Feb 27 2013, 11:52 AM
esp13
Feb 27 2013, 11:39 AM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
Well, there might be a way that Will, EJ and Lucas an get their legal ducks in a row and do just that. PLUS, Sonny is a witness to Nick's blackmail threat. There HAS to be a way to have Will confess and NOT get thrown into jail. He was a minor, he was coerced into not turning himself in by a parent and the man he shot has NO desire to press charges. There are SO many extenuating circumstances that at the minimum, he could just get probation and only be forced to stay in Salem.

Sure, there are extenuating circumstances. Attempted murder can get you up to life in prison. I'm sure the extenuating circumstances in Will's case could get him down to 2 years or so (about half of what Nick served for murdering a scumbag while addicted to pain pills).

I continue to find it hilarious that Nick murdering Trent is the most heinous crime anyone has ever committed, but Will shooting EJ is no worse than jaywalking.
Well, I wasn't watching when this Nick stuff happened. So my point of view is based on what I'm seeing of him now. And I not only see a homophope, I see a seriously unbalanced individual who CLEARLY hasn't worked out the issues that lead him to becoming 1) an addict 2) a creepy obessed stalker 3) a murderer.

And the fact that he's trying to convince himself and everyone that marrying Gabi and raising the baby will just "erase" all of his problems and his personal history, sends up BIG HONKIN' RED FLAGS and warning light to anyone with a brain.

So, yeah, I'm inclined to give Will more of a pass. He was a KID and he was instructed by his PARENTS to do the wrong thing. And hasn't he kept his nose clean since?
I don't disagree with the assessment of who Nick is now, but I was referring to the multitude of opinions about how Nick is unfit because he's a convicted murderer and/or that Will is so much better than Nick because he only attempted to murder somebody.

As for Will, has he really kept his nose clean? He was working for EJ and willingly doing illegal things (including helping to rig an election). He's been on the good side of things since then, but it's not like shooting EJ was Will's only crime.

And, to be clear, I don't think Nick is a good guy. And if it were just about Will, I'd totally be on Will's side. But Nick compared to EJ and Sami is pretty much an equal match of creepy, criminal, obessesive behavior.
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Angelsmile


esp13
Feb 27 2013, 11:58 AM
Pookie
Feb 27 2013, 11:52 AM
esp13
Feb 27 2013, 11:39 AM
Angelsmile
Feb 27 2013, 11:36 AM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
That might be true (although the popular perception of coercion and the legal definition aren't always the same) but the only way to prove he was coerced is to reveal that he shot EJ and Nick blackmailed him. That's not exactly a good scenario.
Well, there might be a way that Will, EJ and Lucas an get their legal ducks in a row and do just that. PLUS, Sonny is a witness to Nick's blackmail threat. There HAS to be a way to have Will confess and NOT get thrown into jail. He was a minor, he was coerced into not turning himself in by a parent and the man he shot has NO desire to press charges. There are SO many extenuating circumstances that at the minimum, he could just get probation and only be forced to stay in Salem.

Sure, there are extenuating circumstances. Attempted murder can get you up to life in prison. I'm sure the extenuating circumstances in Will's case could get him down to 2 years or so (about half of what Nick served for murdering a scumbag while addicted to pain pills).

I continue to find it hilarious that Nick murdering Trent is the most heinous crime anyone has ever committed, but Will shooting EJ is no worse than jaywalking.
Nick murdering someone is not the most heinous crime anyone has ever committed. However, a murderer trying to take the legal and moral high ground because he went to jail is ridiculous especially considering he is committing a crime. Also, while the circumstances do not change what Will did, the circumstances do make the difference. Will's age and state of mind are a consideration in mitigating the crime and while kids can be tried as an adult that mostly occurs in heinous murder cases and that is not what this is. Most of the problem with Nick is what he is doing now as opposed to what he has done previously. As for the characters' reaction to Nick's past versus Will's past it make sense when you consider that Nick is incensed that Will has not had to pay for his crimes while at the same time he has taken steps to make sure that Gabi does not have to pay for hers.
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Pookie
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Maybe the legal eagles can weigh in but I would suspect that Nick's ILLEGALLY obtained tape would be inadmissable in a court of law. He was stupid enough to not only to have a witness to his blackmail, the witness is the son of a lawyer. And I think a few have already stated that even if Will signs the papers, there is a waiting period of several months before the severing of parental rights can become finalized.

So, Nick the "genius" hasn't thought this whole thing through. Let alone the personal ramifications of pulling such a stunt. Will's 180 won't go unnoticed and will raise even more questions and problems for Nick. I mean does he HONESTLY think that people like Sami, EJ, Lucas, Sonny, Kate, Marlena are just going to roll over? Does he REALLY think people like Rafe, Gabi, Hope and Jennifer are not going to ask questions?

Will may be acting like a pussy right now. But Nick is acting like an egotistical moron who's building a house of cards that are guaranteed to fall all over him.
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