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NBC Weekly Preview 9/30/13
Topic Started: Sep 27 2013, 04:12 PM (4,799 Views)
am103
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I LOVE that the show is addressing this. Why NOT use your show's 50 years of history to drive new stories? It would be stupid not to. What's also stupid is that we missed out on any kind of reaction from Abigail and that at the end of whatever this little arc is, JJ will inevitably worship Daniel the same way the rest of Salem does.

Still, I'm cautiously optimistic.
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esp13
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Kayla and Jack were married in 1987. It was before Kayla married Steve but after she and Steve fell in love. It is a long complicated story which is probably better explained on various websites. But basically Kayla married Jack because Steve had dumped her and Jack was emotionally blackmailing her with his cancer. She didn't love and shouldn't have married him. But she did. And after he found out that she was having an affair with Steve (another complicated story) he got angry and raped her.
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uclan
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granolagirl
Sep 29 2013, 04:05 PM
uclan
Sep 29 2013, 03:55 PM
I didn't watch when Jack assaulted Kayla, but I did watch the you tube clip. Looking at it from today's perspective, there was lots of grey. No one was a complete fault; all 3 played a significant part in what occurred.
Each was at fault for different things. There was nothing gray about the rape itself, or exculpatory for Jack in the others' wrongdoings.
Trust me, I don't excuse Jack at all. His actions were wrong. (all of them) I just don't think you can separate all of the character actions and choices that culminated in the rape. Chalk it up to excellent writing choices. The character interaction and development eventually led to Jack's road to redemption. I just hope all of this is played out in this dealing.
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Kriss4


Romancer66
Sep 29 2013, 04:15 PM
Kriss4
Sep 29 2013, 03:42 PM
She's not necessarily trying to change his opinion about Jack. She gets irritated, makes a slip, then clams up. JJ goes elsewhere for answers first, I think. Maybe he finds the transcripts and then pushes for answers.

But as a rule, Kayla isn't vindictive, and if she'd wanted to, she had plenty of opportunity to tell the kids the truth long ago. She didn't.

I'm curious to see how it plays out. But I will say one thing...she was the victim of Jack at that time. He raped her, then he threatened and intimidated her to boot.

She may have a care for Jj's feelings and his perception of his dad..if she's saying he assaulted her, she's already downplaying it for him...but she has to what? Shield Jack for his son's sake?

Part of me respects that. Part of me feels a little sad for her as well as JJ, because it must hurt her too, and she's had to swallow that down for years...for Steve's sake, and then for the kids.

Jack earned the forgiveness, but is the pain erased entirely because Jack was genuinely sorry?



I don't think it's really about shielding Jack anymore--he's "dead" at the moment, so what he'd feel about all this resurfacing is kind of a moot point. It's more about recognizing that JJ's positive feelings about Jack are as valid as her negative/ambivalent ones about him. And would telling Jack's son about the rape ease Kayla's pain--or would it just spread that pain to someone who had nothing to do with it because he didn't even exist at the time? Kayla isn't vindictive, I agree, and she doesn't strike me as someone who'd visit the sins of the father on the son. She may even feel guilty later on learning that JJ went digging for answers and spiraled out of control when he found them. It's a gray area, and there are no easy solutions. On the other hand, I don't know why Kayla would be surprised or even irritated that a son prefers his father to his mother's new boyfriend. Or that the son thinks the new boyfriend is a jerk. Why should it matter to Kayla that her nephew thinks more highly of his father than of Daniel, who's nothing more than a co-worker to her? Wouldn't any loyal son feel the same way? It just irritates me that Daniel plays any part in this scenario at all, even an indirect one. I think most people can agree that there's plenty of drama in this situation without inserting him into the mix.
I think it is about shielding Jack in a way. It's FOR JJ, but it does shield Jack.

It sounds like she downplays it, calling it assault rather than rape. That's for JJ. It downplays the severity of what happened.



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bygnedys


I remember Steve was about to stop the wedding and then Jo showed up beside him and reminded him that Kayla was his brother's chance to live and survive the cancer. Jack had told anyone who would listen that he didn't want to live if Kayla didn't marry him.

I think Kayla married Jack No. 2, I couldn't stand him. Matt told over the part after they came back from the honeymoon and he immediately owned the part.
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granolagirl
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Yep -- Jo was as much a part of the complicated dynamics of that story as anyone else.

The scene where Kayla and Steve told her that Jack -- her baby boy -- had raped Kayla was very good.

Quote:
 
I think it is about shielding Jack in a way. It's FOR JJ, but it does shield Jack.


I think so, too. And I don't think Kayla is obligated to help preserve JJ's illusions about his father. She has been forced to have a relationship with her rapist because he was part of her family, and made the best of it, but how long are you obligated to continue that facade after his death? When does she get the opportunity to live in her truth?
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TreasureCove
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But these writers honestly don't give a shit about the complex, on-going emotions a woman experinces after being raped. I doubt they even see it as a crime, because they don't care. Kayla will likely have about three or four lines to say, than disappear and pop up smiling a month from now to cheerfully praise Daniel and fetch
Edited by TreasureCove, Sep 29 2013, 06:37 PM.
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Kriss4


I have such mixed feelings about this. I understand everyone's desire to protect JJ and Abby from what Jack did. They're innocent of it, and they love their dad. That's as it should be. But at the same time, I'm not all about Jack. I see things from Kayla's perspective.

She loved Steve very much. He was on the verge of making a commitment to her. He planned to pop the question. That same night, he finds out Jack is Billy, and that he's dying.

Well, what to do? Dump your girl. The one you love, because your brother loves her, and he's so sick. Don't tell her anything. Leave her in the dark as to the truth of Jack's identity. Leave her bewildered. Make sure she's good and hurt and angry with you, too, for good measure. Make what he had with Kayla had seem like nothing more than an ordinary "shore leave" for a sailor. Push and push and push until she turns the way you want her to go, even if it breaks your heart, because baby brother has to come first.

Then baby brother, in love, and telling Melissa that if he can't have Kayla, what's the point in living anyway? proposes, putting Kayla in a very difficult position. She could say no, but if she does, and he dies, then what? She DOESN'T know he's Billy, but he is her friend...and she and Steve aren't together, even though she doesn't understand why. But Jack needs her. Maybe she can do him some good anyway.

Steve decided what should happen. He took steps to MAKE it happen, even loving Kayla as he did, because he wanted his brother to live. Jack wanted Kayla. He should have Kayla.

Steve broke her heart.

After she found out the truth about Jack being Billy when she came around after having been poisoned, still she was supposed to put Jack first...Stay in the marriage, Kayla, just for a little while longer. Just until the election. Let's leave him with something to hold onto.

So once again, she does what Steve wants. She has other choices, but none of them are all that good. She decides to go along with Steve. She's reluctant, but she sees sense in what he says. If Jack has the election, if he wins, he'll have something important to him to keep him from going under.

Things blow up. Jack rapes her. Steve finds out...he gets in a big fight with Jack on the roof of Kayla's loft apartment. Jack falls. Steve feels guilty about it because they were fighting. Jack's kidney's damaged. Steve gives Jack his kidney. When Jack's body shows signs of rejecting the kidney, his mental state is discussed. He's not in a good way. He needs to feel positive about his life. Mental state is the key.

Oh. Well, then Kayla should forgive him. Right? Cuz that'll make a difference for Jack.

Uh uh. No way.

She didn't. Wasn't ready.

But...the thought was there. She was supposed to do whatever needed to be done for Jack. And now, because of a slip of the tongue that creates a problem, she'll try to do whatever she can for JJ, to protect him.

But I always think, what about her?

Make no mistake. I love Steve...and in the storyline, you see how much he loves her...how much he longs to be with her. But you also know he's loved and missed his baby brother since he was five and Billy was a baby. That's when Billy was adopted by the Deveraux family.

So you understand his feelings and the why of what he does, but you see a lot of pain and sadness and bewilderment in Kayla as she struggles to figure out what's going on with Steve, and then deals with an unhappy marriage to Jack.











Edited by Kriss4, Sep 29 2013, 06:58 PM.
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granolagirl
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TreasureCove
Sep 29 2013, 06:36 PM
But these writers honestly don't give a shit about the complex, on-going emotions a woman experinces after being raped. I doubt they even see it as a crime, because they don't care. Kayla will likely have about three or four lines to say, than disappear and pop up smiling a month from now to cheerfully praise Daniel and fetch
They don't give a shit about Jack, either, but people still talk about what they want to see for his perspective.

I'm tired of assuming that the woman's perspective will take a back seat and the audience is just supposed to accept it -- but let's make sure her rapist gets his say.
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LastLicks
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Unfortunately wishing Jack was here for this isn't going to change the fact that he isn't, so I just have to somehow make my peace and enjoy that he's still part of the story in some way. I just hope it's not completely skewed, because while Kayla has every right and should hate him for what happened, I also don't believe she does based on what was already told. Of course, emotions are complex and just because she forgave him doesn't also mean it doesn't still affect her, and she doesn't still resent him when she thinks of it. I'm all for exploring that, as long as it isn't cut and dry . . . which may be fine for some, not for me. I do get nervous about the details; read a spoiler:
Spoiler: click to toggle
Jack's reputation being shattered over this doesn't really bother me (he was the villain and we loved that), but I also agree with those who really do not want to see this used against Jack to paint Daniel in a better light. I don't care whether Daniel is good, bad or whatever in between--I still don't like him.
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jwsel
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JDeveraux_91
Sep 29 2013, 04:10 PM
ladyofthelake
Sep 29 2013, 03:46 PM
T-Love74
Sep 28 2013, 01:24 PM
The Rape: @3:33 mark



PART 2:
Damn, I miss Matt Ashford.
I miss Matt and Stephen Nichols and most importantly, the Days of our Lives that once was. With compelling, dramatic stories and interesting layered characters. Those clips really show me how far this show has fallen. I also hate how Jack was reduced to a grandpa sweater wearing background character during his last run. The character is so much more interesting when he's being a jerk, not that I want him to come back and be a criminal or rapist, but Jack with an edge was so much better than what MarDar, Tomlin, Higley, etc. gave us.
Thinking about how the show was written back then, I am reminded that the rape occurred in the same episode where Kim loses her and Shane's child after she saves Eve. It's not just that the show back then could write a compelling storyline, but it could weave multiple storylines that were powerful, complicated, and gave the actors wonderful material to work with. It's amazing to think how much the show could pack into just one episode -- and it wasn't even sweeps.
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Kriss4


LastLicks
Sep 29 2013, 07:49 PM
Unfortunately wishing Jack was here for this isn't going to change the fact that he isn't, so I just have to somehow make my peace and enjoy that he's still part of the story in some way. I just hope it's not completely skewed, because while Kayla has every right and should hate him for what happened, I also don't believe she does based on what was already told. Of course, emotions are complex and just because she forgave him doesn't also mean it doesn't still affect her, and she doesn't still resent him when she thinks of it. I'm all for exploring that, as long as it isn't cut and dry . . . which may be fine for some, not for me. I do get nervous about the details; read a spoiler:
Spoiler: click to toggle
Jack's reputation being shattered over this doesn't really bother me (he was the villain and we loved that), but I also agree with those who really do not want to see this used against Jack to paint Daniel in a better light. I don't care whether Daniel is good, bad or whatever in between--I still don't like him.
It was a pretrial hearing, wasn't it?

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bygnedys


I think it was my favorite story of Steve and Kayla, but it was so hard to watch sometimes.

Kayla being the one that suffered so much because she didn't want to fight Steve and she didn't want to hurt Jack. If Steve had listened to Kayla, none of it would have happened. He couldn't make himself tell her the truth till after Kayla was poisoned and then he couldn't keep it from her anymore, when she almost died. I still remember the scene where Alice helped Steve sneak Kayla out of the hospital so whoever was trying to kill her couldn't get to her.

Those stories were so good back then, and the leading up to Jack finding out he was really Billy Johnson.
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Kriss4


It was very engrossing. I love watching it even to this day. It makes me angry, sad, happy, and every feeling in between. Now, I just hope I'll get something to love now and then.

If they'd give me some real Kayla in all this, I'd be very pleased. Kayla with thoughts and feelings of her own about what happened to her. I know we'll see JJ's perspective. I figure we'll see Jennifer's when everything comes out. Will we see Kayla's too?

If we do...if we see everyone's perspective, and if it's not about you know who aside from the beginning of the Kayla/JJ scene, we will have scored a win in the story department.
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somuchwhatever
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Brotherly Love

Kriss4
Sep 29 2013, 07:58 PM
LastLicks
Sep 29 2013, 07:49 PM
Unfortunately wishing Jack was here for this isn't going to change the fact that he isn't, so I just have to somehow make my peace and enjoy that he's still part of the story in some way. I just hope it's not completely skewed, because while Kayla has every right and should hate him for what happened, I also don't believe she does based on what was already told. Of course, emotions are complex and just because she forgave him doesn't also mean it doesn't still affect her, and she doesn't still resent him when she thinks of it. I'm all for exploring that, as long as it isn't cut and dry . . . which may be fine for some, not for me. I do get nervous about the details; read a spoiler:
Spoiler: click to toggle
Jack's reputation being shattered over this doesn't really bother me (he was the villain and we loved that), but I also agree with those who really do not want to see this used against Jack to paint Daniel in a better light. I don't care whether Daniel is good, bad or whatever in between--I still don't like him.
It was a pretrial hearing, wasn't it?

It was. I just finished rewatching the whole thing last weekend.

There was a pretrial hearing and Kayla went on the stand and told what happened. Jack was affected by it and indicated to his attorney that he just wanted it all to go away so his lawyer offered assault as a plea bargain and Kayla's lawyer (Mickey Horton) recommended she accept it. She did.

And then Jack was a total jackass after the fact. He had been owning and apologizing what he did at first, but when Kayla made no qualms about telling him that she wasn't going to hide what he had done and that he had no right to rape her, he spiraled down into total sleazedom. The absolute moment of rock bottom, I think, was finding out he was Billy Johnson and then, practically at the same time, finding out Harper, whom he had idolized his entire life, had tried to murder his wife and was a serial killer. It shattered every illusion of who Jack thought he was, and then the crowning moment was Melissa dumping him at the altar.

I think the turning point for Jack was during the Baby Hannah storyline with Jen when he got rejected from being a potential foster parent because of the assault on his record. Between Jen's non-coddling of him about the reality of his life and that moment when he saw an outsider's perspective on just what he had done, I think that's the moment he started turning things around.

The thing I am absolutely amazed about during the storyline, though, is how strong Kayla is during it. She refuses to be taken hostage by what happened, even to the point where she calls Steve on his crap when he tries to get her to coddle Jack afterwards. Before this storyline, I had viewed Kayla as the typical soap heroine whose basic role is to be there for the dude to rescue. But not after this one. That opinion changed the moment she got up after she was raped, looked in the face of her rapist and called it out for what it was. It was something unheard of for the late 80s, and it's still stands as one of the most defining moments of soaps for me as a woman.

For anyone who HASN'T watched this storyline, please, go watch it. It won't be time wasted, and it'll make you weep for what you see onscreen these days. It's a master class in writing, acting, and seamless storytelling.
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esp13
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I agree with everything you said except for one thing. Kayla's testimony didn't change Jack's mind. What changed his mind was the judge saying there was enough evidence to move forward and Harper wanting to do damage control.
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somuchwhatever
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Brotherly Love

I just said he was affected by it, not that it changed his mind. You're absolutely right in your interpretation.
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AHM


Panda Panda
Sep 27 2013, 04:32 PM
I don't see how having Jack back would help JJ not hate him for what he did? Jack raped Kayla. There's no justification, no "other side", and no explanation behind his assault. And there shouldn't be.

I'm not too fond of the fact that this storyline is skating on the fringes of Fetch break/makeup #267253625362, but if the writers can somehow keep this story about JJ, Kayla, Jack, and Jennifer (ONLY THEM) then I wouldn't mind seeing how everything plays out
First, hey, that was a great promo. Because it included a clip from a time when this show was really, really good. And Jack in a promo. Awesome. Also, tapping into the show's rich history is something I think DAYS should do. However, this whole thing is annoying to me too. Yeah, the rape was bad and Jack did it and it was bad. Heinous. Yes. But I don't think anything is ever black and white and circumstances do matter. I'm not trying to excuse Jack, but I do think there is a place of understanding his point of view that isn't inappropriate and doesn't mean that I think rape is ever okay under any circumstances and doesn't mean Jack shouldn't have had the book thrown at him. (Though luckily he didn't, because Jack in jail wouldn't have been nearly as good drama). But the circumstances leading to what Jack did and Jack's journey afterward do make me not hate Jack, so his son, yeah, I think it would be very possible for JJ to come around to not hating Jack. I also think Jack being there would eventually help with that, but that's not really what I mean to address, and JJ hating Jack isn't my main issue. I want JJ to be disappointed and enraged, or at least I would want that if I thought this story would play in such a way that anyone who didn't see Jack's story could understand how complicated the history is. But I think it'll play such that a lot of people who don't have a clue will say, "See how bad Jack was! Daniel is way better." Of course, my idea of a character being "better" has nothing to do with the character being good or bad, and more to do with the character being interesting, which Jack is and Daniel ain't. So, yeah, I want JJ to have a strong reaction. And I can even see what some are saying about layers being there for JJ with Jack dead that wouldn't be there with Jack alive. And yet. None of that makes up for the scenes we won't get that I want to see. I want to see Jack and JJ in a room together after JJ learns. I want that kind of juicy. Ir's not about mitigating the hatred. It's about me wanting to see the tension and the awkward and the pain and the angst between Jack and JJ that I will not see with Jack dead. And what can I say? I adore Matt Ashford's Jack. He remains the only reason I have any lingering interest in the show, so of course I'd rather he were here for this story. But I am glad to see his character continuing to impact the show.
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Kriss4


I understand your point of view. I understand what you'd hoped to see if this ever came up, compared to what you will see.

I'm glad it's coming up. It's the first time in forever that something involving Kayla's life's been featured. I think Days has been remiss, having Mary Beth around for so long, yet giving her nothing much in her LIFE outside of doctor and pal, so my perspective is different than yours, as I am totally and completely a Kayla fan.

That is not to say that I'm not glad to have her around, even if she IS Dr. Kayla, but it isn't really enough for me, and it's led to some frustration over the past couple of years.

But you are a Jack fan, and you'd want him here. You see the possibilities that you aren't going to have realized and that's hard.

I don't know how it'll all play out. Wish I did. I devoured Casey and Mary Beth's interviews in particular...Well, I would have devoured Mary Beth's anyway, LOL! But given the promo and what's coming up, there was even MORE interest in seeing if she'd say anything about what's coming next week, and she does add some little tidbits.

But I get where you're coming from. I know how you love Jack. I understand it completely, given how I feel about Kayla.

I hope someday Jack comes back. No one can tell me it's not possible. Maybe it's not wise. Too many coming back from the dead stories...that's the knock. But Days hasn't gone to that well for awhile. It must be almost time, LOL! And really, who has more experience at making it work than Matt?

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AHM


Kriss, I am glad that Kayla might get some meat out of this. I hope she gets some good stuff. I am annoyed that her breakup with Steve continues to be left hanging. What's up with that? It's Steve and Kayla. If DAYS is not going to milk their breakup for some kind of drama or to give Kayla something else, why bother?
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