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Friday, November 1st Daily Discussion
Topic Started: Nov 1 2013, 12:55 AM (10,568 Views)
Lady Evol


six
Nov 2 2013, 09:07 AM
Keith
Nov 1 2013, 11:42 PM
six
Nov 1 2013, 05:19 PM
Rosebud
Nov 1 2013, 04:57 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
Sorry, I still don't see the big deal. I'm okay with the children of people who are "like family" dating. I'm just not okay with actual family members dating.

Also, it would bother me if the sorasing erased a part of Shawn or Belle's history, but it didn't so I'm fine with that, too.
GMAB. They are not "like family". The writers simply decided to pretend they weren't when they wanted to pair them. Shawn didn't call Marlena Aunt because his parents were close to Marlena. She was literally his aunt. Divorce doesn't stop aunt from being aunt. Shawn and Belle are a great example of two characters who never should have been paired based on history and story, but actor chemistry and producer demands made it happen anyway.
Sorry I'm not pretending everyone does things the way that your family does them. If someone is your aunt through marriage and the marriage dissolves, the other relationships dissolve, too. She isn't your uncle's wife, or your grandparents' daughter in law, or your aunt anymore. You are of course, free to keep considering your uncles ex wife your aunt if that's what the two of you want to do, because she still feels like family, but it's not wrong if you don't. And you don't have to consider her kids, who aren't related to you, to be your cousins.

Sami was Abby and JJ's aunt. She isn't anymore and when we see Abby and Sami in scenes, Abby isn't calling her "Aunt Sami" because they were never close enough for the title to outlast the marriage.
Yeah, this is pretty much how it works. Once you're divorced, they're no longer a part of your family. I actually have a sister in law that doesn't allow her sons to call me aunt. My husband and I have been together for the youngest's entire life, and she and I get along quite well, but she does not call me her sister and flipped out on her step mother for telling him I'm his aunt. It's not a big deal, it isn't a blood relation, and different people handle it differently. But divorce definitely severs the family ties. Maintaining them is a matter of preference, not legality.
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jwsel
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Rosebud
Nov 2 2013, 10:56 PM
Supergirlx2
Nov 2 2013, 10:31 PM
i<3ddjmalways
Nov 2 2013, 07:26 PM
lysie
Nov 2 2013, 07:13 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deepHi, Mrs. Brady!Cast Photo / Jason47 Website
Yes especially considering Sami was a teenager when Belle was born and now we are supposed to believe that they are close to the same age? Okay... :eyeroll:

Another thing is the show has seem to forgotten that John and Marlena even have a child. They seem to have forgotten that Belle even exists! I mean she is mentioned from time to time but it's almost like they want us to forget her. :shame:

People seem to forget that Hope has another child as well. The only reason Shawn was mentioned at all recently was because Bo was with him, & Hope & Ciara visited him, Belle, & Claire last Christmas.
There are a lot of children who are not in Salem that are barely (if at all) mentioned.
Yet TomSell just felt it was so important to bring Jeanie back even though her parents are no longer in Salem and haven't been in many years... :rolleyes:
The problem with bringing Belle back is that a Belle return doesn't work when all the writers do is write relationship-based storylines. They either have to bring Belle back with Shawn or explain why he is not in the picture. If the writers do the latter, they infuriate long-time fans. And if they bring Belle back with Shawn, what do they do with her that is different than what they did with Carrie/Austin, the happily married couple that then need to be put through contrived situations to break them up? And we hardly need another Jennifer/Daniel, who have the constant interloper trying to break them up.

Jeannie at least is a character with a connection to Salem that had unlimited potential. Because she has not been shown in Salem growing up, she is a blank slate that could have been anything. And it would have been easy to introduce her into the fabric using her Brady connections, because Shane and Kim are hardly forgotten by viewers; she has plenty of family around Salem; and there are plenty of other major relatives -- Victor, Marlena, John, Jennifer, Adrienne, Stefano, Maggie, Rafe -- who have histories with her parents that should have made them interested in Jeannie.

Unfortunately, the writers have barely tried to build on that history, did nothing to connect her to her cousins, which could have been very easy to do, and have made her a virtual stranger to the Bradys. Just a few lines here and there would have helped. Why couldn't they have Jeannie and Eric reminisce about some trip to California or England instead of having her call him "Father" and act like he was just a priest? Or since Jeannie is closer in age to Will, maybe he could have mentioned her being the "cool" cousin he hung with in LA on a couple of vacations.

It also doesn't help that they made Jeannie completely aimless and a screwed-up druggie because it fit the Jennifer/Daniel storyline. Now we have yet another young female character who has no ambition, career goals, and is going to just wander through Salem chasing after one guy after another. And because Jeannie has to be the "evil bitch" to Saint Jennifer, she can't even be written as particularly smart, which is a shame, because the one thing that Shane's and Kim's kids should have is intelligence.
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lysie
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i<3ddjmalways
Nov 2 2013, 11:11 PM
Rosebud
Nov 2 2013, 10:56 PM
Supergirlx2
Nov 2 2013, 10:31 PM
i<3ddjmalways
Nov 2 2013, 07:26 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deepHi, Mrs. Brady!Cast Photo / Jason47 Website
People seem to forget that Hope has another child as well. The only reason Shawn was mentioned at all recently was because Bo was with him, & Hope & Ciara visited him, Belle, & Claire last Christmas.
There are a lot of children who are not in Salem that are barely (if at all) mentioned.
Yet TomSell just felt it was so important to bring Jeanie back even though her parents are no longer in Salem and haven't been in many years... :rolleyes:
Yeah and to change her name from Jeannie to her middle name Theresa, make her a troublemaker and drug addict. What does that say about Shane and Kim as parents? I mean really? It's almost like a slap in the face to their history, from what we could tell through the years that even though Shane and Kim weren't together, Jeannie and Andrew had a good childhood and were well loved by both of their parents and stepparents respectively. There was really no reason to bring her back and make her so awful. :shame:

What about what they did to Patch and Kayla? Give them a son, Joey only to have them divorce through a text message? Kayla going back to her maiden name? Kayla would never just give up on Steve like that, nor would he give up on her. Ridiculous. They want us to forget about Steve, just like they want us to forget about Jack. So dumb! :angry:
I don't think Theresa's issues reflect badly on Shane and Kim as parents. Not on a soap. And honestly, not even real life. Great parents sometimes produce really rotten offspring.
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Kriss4


I just look at Steve and Kayla's divorce as a troubled period in their lives. Steve working for the ISA was just something Kayla couldn't deal with, since he was working for them when he disappeared years ago, and that led to a lot of heartache for her. She's not willing to wait for the other shoe to drop this time, just accepting his choice. I figure maybe there's more to it than just Steve wanting to work for the ISA, but we'll never know unless Stephen returns.


Soap couples divorce and remarry, and if Stephen returns, perhaps Steve and Kayla will work out their issues and remarry, too.

John's coming back, and I figure he and Marlena have issues to work out and they probably will.
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jwsel
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lysie
Nov 2 2013, 11:20 PM
i<3ddjmalways
Nov 2 2013, 11:11 PM
Rosebud
Nov 2 2013, 10:56 PM
Supergirlx2
Nov 2 2013, 10:31 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deepHi, Mrs. Brady!Cast Photo / Jason47 Website
Yet TomSell just felt it was so important to bring Jeanie back even though her parents are no longer in Salem and haven't been in many years... :rolleyes:
Yeah and to change her name from Jeannie to her middle name Theresa, make her a troublemaker and drug addict. What does that say about Shane and Kim as parents? I mean really? It's almost like a slap in the face to their history, from what we could tell through the years that even though Shane and Kim weren't together, Jeannie and Andrew had a good childhood and were well loved by both of their parents and stepparents respectively. There was really no reason to bring her back and make her so awful. :shame:

What about what they did to Patch and Kayla? Give them a son, Joey only to have them divorce through a text message? Kayla going back to her maiden name? Kayla would never just give up on Steve like that, nor would he give up on her. Ridiculous. They want us to forget about Steve, just like they want us to forget about Jack. So dumb! :angry:
I don't think Theresa's issues reflect badly on Shane and Kim as parents. Not on a soap. And honestly, not even real life. Great parents sometimes produce really rotten offspring.
I actually think Jeannie Theresa's use of "Theresa" and her views of her parents could be a great story -- if the writers actually develop the character. Jeannie was Shane's mother's name, so her decision not to use Jeannie could be a conscious choice to reject him as her father. Now we know Shane and can't believe he wasn't a loving parent, since we saw him with Andrew on the show. However, there are plenty of possible reasons why Jeannie would have perceived him otherwise. We know Shane was with the ISA through 2010 and probably spent a year imprisoned at that time. So how much was Shane around during Jeannie's childhood? And how many times were his visits with the kids interrupted by ISA emergencies? I know in my fanfics, adult Jeannie and Shane are estranged for those reasons, though I write her as much more of a super-achiever, someone who wants to prove she can be a success on her own (and in my websoap, she uses her stepfather's name, Collier, not Donovan). But having her turn to partying as a way of rejecting the expectations and pressure that Shane probably placed on her -- along with the name that connects her to him -- also is a way that some kids rebel against their parents.

The problem I have is that the show's writers haven't given us any motivations for the character's behaviors and haven't made any attempt to give her more dimension. I have no idea why she is so focused on making Jennifer's life miserable. I think the show really missed the mark by not having Jeannie bond with JJ early on. During the scenes in her apartment where they were talking about their parents last week, they showed what they could have been doing for the past four months. It's just a shame we didn't get that character development earlier on.
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Keith
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jwsel
Nov 2 2013, 11:39 PM
lysie
Nov 2 2013, 11:20 PM
i<3ddjmalways
Nov 2 2013, 11:11 PM
Rosebud
Nov 2 2013, 10:56 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deepHi, Mrs. Brady!Cast Photo / Jason47 Website
Yeah and to change her name from Jeannie to her middle name Theresa, make her a troublemaker and drug addict. What does that say about Shane and Kim as parents? I mean really? It's almost like a slap in the face to their history, from what we could tell through the years that even though Shane and Kim weren't together, Jeannie and Andrew had a good childhood and were well loved by both of their parents and stepparents respectively. There was really no reason to bring her back and make her so awful. :shame:

What about what they did to Patch and Kayla? Give them a son, Joey only to have them divorce through a text message? Kayla going back to her maiden name? Kayla would never just give up on Steve like that, nor would he give up on her. Ridiculous. They want us to forget about Steve, just like they want us to forget about Jack. So dumb! :angry:
I don't think Theresa's issues reflect badly on Shane and Kim as parents. Not on a soap. And honestly, not even real life. Great parents sometimes produce really rotten offspring.
I actually think Jeannie Theresa's use of "Theresa" and her views of her parents could be a great story -- if the writers actually develop the character. Jeannie was Shane's mother's name, so her decision not to use Jeannie could be a conscious choice to reject him as her father. Now we know Shane and can't believe he wasn't a loving parent, since we saw him with Andrew on the show. However, there are plenty of possible reasons why Jeannie would have perceived him otherwise. We know Shane was with the ISA through 2010 and probably spent a year imprisoned at that time. So how much was Shane around during Jeannie's childhood? And how many times were his visits with the kids interrupted by ISA emergencies? I know in my fanfics, adult Jeannie and Shane are estranged for those reasons, though I write her as much more of a super-achiever, someone who wants to prove she can be a success on her own (and in my websoap, she uses her stepfather's name, Collier, not Donovan). But having her turn to partying as a way of rejecting the expectations and pressure that Shane probably placed on her -- along with the name that connects her to him -- also is a way that some kids rebel against their parents.

The problem I have is that the show's writers haven't given us any motivations for the character's behaviors and haven't made any attempt to give her more dimension. I have no idea why she is so focused on making Jennifer's life miserable. I think the show really missed the mark by not having Jeannie bond with JJ early on. During the scenes in her apartment where they were talking about their parents last week, they showed what they could have been doing for the past four months. It's just a shame we didn't get that character development earlier on.
I'm still mad JT has never mentioned Eve, who had equal distaste for Jenny - a nickname both sisters use in a similar way.

You're dead-on about motivation and careers driving story. It is all so vapid now. And relationships don't actually matter in the end. A relationship just ends. No ramifications unless the couple isn't actually over. And the ramifications we see, particular among the 30s 40s and 50s crowd is less mature than said characters were in their teens and twenties.
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MissFancyFace
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"I want to get to know you better."

Snowing Fan
Nov 1 2013, 11:32 PM
Jennifer,breaking news....THE WORLD DOESN'T REVOLVE AROUND YOU.
Maybe if a fan base that TIIC do cater to tweeted that memo to the show, they'd finally get the message. :whistle:
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esp13
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mer4santo
Nov 2 2013, 10:26 PM
BeeBee
Nov 2 2013, 12:46 PM
mer4santo
Nov 1 2013, 08:04 PM
I'm sorry but nobody who has been burned by Nicole should ever trust her word. She has too many whoppers under her belt.
Nicole is not the only person in Salem who has given voice to serious lies.The list is too long.Based on the harmful past lies criterion,no one would trust the word of most of Salem's residents.
This is true, however in ToDAY'S episode only Nicole was begging people to believe her word was good and that she would never do something like hurting someone she loved.
To be fair, she wasn't asking Daniel to believe she hadn't done anything. She was asking him very specifically to believe she hadn't raped Eric. I think Daniel and others could easily believe there were many things Nicole could do without believing she had done that. So, to me, it wasn't as simple as Nicole saying she would never hurt someone she loved. It was much more specific and I don't think it's a stretch for Daniel to believe her, or even for Nicole to ask him to believe her.
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ladyofthelake
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Professor-in-training

esp13
Nov 3 2013, 09:23 AM
mer4santo
Nov 2 2013, 10:26 PM
BeeBee
Nov 2 2013, 12:46 PM
mer4santo
Nov 1 2013, 08:04 PM
I'm sorry but nobody who has been burned by Nicole should ever trust her word. She has too many whoppers under her belt.
Nicole is not the only person in Salem who has given voice to serious lies.The list is too long.Based on the harmful past lies criterion,no one would trust the word of most of Salem's residents.
This is true, however in ToDAY'S episode only Nicole was begging people to believe her word was good and that she would never do something like hurting someone she loved.
To be fair, she wasn't asking Daniel to believe she hadn't done anything. She was asking him very specifically to believe she hadn't raped Eric. I think Daniel and others could easily believe there were many things Nicole could do without believing she had done that. So, to me, it wasn't as simple as Nicole saying she would never hurt someone she loved. It was much more specific and I don't think it's a stretch for Daniel to believe her, or even for Nicole to ask him to believe her.
Definitely. With all the mea culpas and atoning and self-esteem issues about her past she's had (short of self-flagellation), AND her past, I just really think Eric is pissy for blaming her first. And heaven help me, I'm glad SOMEONE (even if it's Daniel) is on her side. Just stay out of her bed, dude.
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DesignatedShelley
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TPTB continue to vastly overrate how tragic Dannifer's separations are. Jennifer came off as pettily judgmental about Theresa today considering that she could've died. Theresa merits a lot of the complaints one could throw at her, she's not hard working, she's manipulative, she takes advantage of people, etc, but the last thing that matters is "she's not good enough for Daniel" which was how the scenes came off to me today.

I had no problems with Maggie today. She's allowed to talk back to Victor as much as she wants as far as I'm concerned.

I hated Abby calling Theresa a slut, but I did like, in a grateful-for-crumbs way, the fact that she "dissed" (not much of a diss, but she still saw it that way so that's something) Daniel. Although it was clunky. Both this and Jennifer's incredulity about Daniel are obviously set-up stuff for the reveal about what really happened, and it's really clunky.

If I were JJ I would tell Jennifer what really happened. I know he is insecure about her reaction, though. But it would be the right thing to do. Also it would cut short the latest round of Dannifer angst, which I hate more than Dannifer together.

Anne is like a walking Strawman Argument, she provides no catharsis for me at all. But I do think Meredith Scott Lynn is pretty great and it's fun watching other actors bounce off of her. Her character's still really petty though.

I actually don't mind if JJ is cool with Daniel, as long as it doesn't go into "I love you like a dad" territory (I'd prefer him being distant if decent though). I've had enough of JJ and everybody and everything acting as Dannifer obstacles, it just means more pro-Dannifer story. It's old as hills soap wisdom that the creation of obstacles is basically pro-couple writing so I'm over that.
Edited by DesignatedShelley, Nov 3 2013, 05:34 PM.
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ArizonaDaze
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Don't get me wrong, I really don't like or want Dannifer, but maybe if they become a happy couple they will be backburnered (is that a word?) like most happy couples are! One can hope anyway.
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DesignatedShelley
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ArizonaDaze
Nov 3 2013, 05:34 PM
Don't get me wrong, I really don't like or want Dannifer, but maybe if they become a happy couple they will be backburnered (is that a word?) like most happy couples are! One can hope anyway.
Yeah, seriously, they might pair Daniel off with someone else but there's really not anyone else around for Jennifer right now. So unless/until MR leaves the show, or Jack (or hell, even Frankie) came back, I'd just rather Dannifer get put on the backburner and stop being the source of so much story. Barring those things there is nothing else to do with that character atm so why not rip the bandaid off and move on, watch other stories, etc.
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ArizonaDaze
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DesignatedShelley
Nov 3 2013, 05:42 PM
ArizonaDaze
Nov 3 2013, 05:34 PM
Don't get me wrong, I really don't like or want Dannifer, but maybe if they become a happy couple they will be backburnered (is that a word?) like most happy couples are! One can hope anyway.
Yeah, seriously, they might pair Daniel off with someone else but there's really not anyone else around for Jennifer right now. So unless/until MR leaves the show, or Jack (or hell, even Frankie) came back, I'd just rather Dannifer get put on the backburner and stop being the source of so much story. Barring those things there is nothing else to do with that character atm so why not rip the bandaid off and move on, watch other stories, etc.
Ah, Frankie. I wouldn't mind it if he came back. Although he would probably be ruined too.
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Graceland
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The scene between Marlena and Ann was amazing!
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mer4santo
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I own you bitch.

esp13
Nov 3 2013, 09:23 AM
mer4santo
Nov 2 2013, 10:26 PM
BeeBee
Nov 2 2013, 12:46 PM
mer4santo
Nov 1 2013, 08:04 PM
I'm sorry but nobody who has been burned by Nicole should ever trust her word. She has too many whoppers under her belt.
Nicole is not the only person in Salem who has given voice to serious lies.The list is too long.Based on the harmful past lies criterion,no one would trust the word of most of Salem's residents.
This is true, however in ToDAY'S episode only Nicole was begging people to believe her word was good and that she would never do something like hurting someone she loved.
To be fair, she wasn't asking Daniel to believe she hadn't done anything. She was asking him very specifically to believe she hadn't raped Eric. I think Daniel and others could easily believe there were many things Nicole could do without believing she had done that. So, to me, it wasn't as simple as Nicole saying she would never hurt someone she loved. It was much more specific and I don't think it's a stretch for Daniel to believe her, or even for Nicole to ask him to believe her.
Yeah, it doesn't fly with me. These are all people she has burned in the past and while THIS is actually the time she DiDNt do anything wrong, I have a diffult time believing anyone would seriously listen to her. I love me some Nicole, but this is a situation I'd rather her be squirming and clawing to find the truth to get out of then have DR Dan believe her. SHE finds the truth and then everyone else has to eat crow.

But that is my fan fic.
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