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Monday, June 2nd Daily Discussion
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Topic Started: May 31 2014, 02:33 AM (38,165 Views)
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ladyofthelake
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Jun 2 2014, 05:59 PM
Post #341
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Professor-in-training
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:popcorn: to some of the discussing going on here. Based on comments about CB's acting, I might have to watch and FF the Ericole scenes. Did I just say that? But I'm so pissed now about how they totally destroyed something..... As for who is right or wrong and what they deserve............PULEEZE. They both need their heads bashed together and be banished to isolation from Fetch. Come to think of it.....putting them in isolation...together....might not be a bad idea.... Fetch could go in that padded room they used in The Green Mile every time they get too involved in someone else's storyline.......Hmmmmmm
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KAM
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Jun 2 2014, 06:04 PM
Post #342
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- concerned
- Jun 2 2014, 03:53 PM
- Yoryla
- Jun 2 2014, 03:43 PM
- concerned
- Jun 2 2014, 03:13 PM
- Yoryla
- Jun 2 2014, 03:04 PM
Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
She really should stop choosing to have miscarriages and stillbirths and get cheated on and have dead girlfriends come back to life. She doesn't handle these thing well (she handles them atrociously) but she generally doesn't start the ball rolling.
Really? Trying to kill Victor. Giving Chloe flesh-eating bacteria. Kidnapping Sami's child and making her think she's dead. Framing Jennifer for killing her unborn baby. Shredding the evidence.
Exactly what I was saying all of those events were pre started by another event not of Nicole's choosing. Victor hadn't of been keeping her as a virtual prisoner and had of left her leave she probably wouldn't have resorted to killing him. If Chloe had of stayed dead she wouldn't have needed to infect her face. If her baby hadn't of died she wouldn't have gone out and kidnapped Sami's kid. If her baby had of lived she wouldn't have framed Jennifer. If Eric hadn't of been drugged and raped Bad stuff happens to Nicole and she doesn't respond well and makes things worse. But she generally doesn't set out to do bad stuff. I see your point that Nicole has not been a proactive schemer like Sami and some other Salemites. That's why she has so many sympathetic fans (including me) hoping she will someday find happiness.
But really...isn't the true test of character in how a person responds to adversity in life? By the hard choices made in bad times?
And your list could begin with this:
If Nicole had told the truth and left Salem to live with her true love, Eric 1, in Colorado, instead of lying and then staying in town to try to wreak vengeance on Victor, then.....
Oh, and LOL at this one: "If Chloe had of stayed dead she wouldn't have needed to infect her face."
How damned inconsiderate of Chloe! I mean, who among us would not have resorted to flesh eating bacteria after that? :blulaugh: :rolleyes: Only in Salem. LOL
Edited by KAM, Jun 2 2014, 06:15 PM.
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iheartwilson
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Jun 2 2014, 06:08 PM
Post #343
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- Ophelia
- Jun 2 2014, 05:26 PM
- franciose
- Jun 2 2014, 05:15 PM
Camilla! When she used her fingers to point to her eye and spoke of seeing Nick, I just marveled at what a really good actor she became while I watched. Then I thought what a damn shame she's right behind BB and about all the great scenes that could have been.
Eric is just ludicrous. What an asshole. I liked Nicole's explanation. Just wished she'd made as big a deal as Hope did about any evidence she and Douchial found being non-admissible in court. It would have bolstered her (actually good) argument. St. Eric DID tell her he chose her. I guess he did so because moving into the abbey with the creepy monk as a way to stay in the church didn't sound as pleasant as being with Nicole. This whole Catholic church won't forgive Eric Brady for his "sin" is ludicrous, anyway.
I agree, CB was just wonderful today. I agree with the others -- I wish she had gone into more detail about things getting physical with Nick and, specifically, that he had tried to rape her. I actually liked Nabi before it all went creepy-stalkery/abusive. At this point I'm willing to wait and see how Eric reacts. He just found out what Nicole did so I'm okay with him being pissed off. If she turns into the town pariah again, I'll be super-angry, though. The evidence was inadmissible in court and the Church may or may not have believed it was real, but we'll never know. I agree, the Church not forgiving him is a little ridiculous. As angry as I am that the writers made such an intolerable mess of the Ericole storyline, I'm more upset over the wasted potential. It would have been so fabulously angsty if Nicole had given him the evidence and Eric had gone back to the Church and begun pining over Nicole, realizing that being a priest isn't what he really wanted and that he was in it for the wrong reasons. So much glorious potential down the crapper. Thanks, idiots. I never liked Nabi. I never liked Nick. I predicted creepy, abusive Nick back in 2012 when Nick found out Will was the father of Gabi's baby.
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concerned
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Jun 2 2014, 06:09 PM
Post #344
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The evidence was inadmissible in court and the Church may or may not have believed it was real[.]
As I have pointed out before (but not in this thread), these arguments miss the point. Whether the evidence was admissible in court is irrelevant. Whether Eric would have been allowed to return to the priesthood on the strength of the evidence is irrelevant. More than anything else, what is relevant is that Nicole took away -- from the person she claims to love -- the one thing that could have given him peace of mind, the one thing that could have proven, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that he was innocent -- if not to anyone else, then at least to himself. Everything else that could have come out of her doing the right thing and giving him the evidence is secondary to that. No matter how sympathetic Nicole is or how good Arianne Zucker is at portraying her, what Nicole did was not an act of love, period. Eric has every right to be upset with her for as long as he wants to be. If the tables were turned and Nicole had learned that Eric had destroyed evidence that could have proven that her father had forced her into the porn industry and that she had never been a willing participant, I'm sure that she would have been livid, even if he'd had what he believed was a very good reason for doing so. But Nicole never believed she was a willing participant in the porn thing. She knew she didn't choose to do it.
And I haven't seen the angle where Eric has ever though he was a willing participant in the rape. There were some moments there early on when he thought it might of been Nicole who raped him where he was slightly unsure but even when he accused her he knew he wasn't a willing participant . Since he found out it was Kristen he's known (and all of the people close to him with the exception of Brady and EJ) have all known that he didn't willingly do it.
I just haven't had a sense that he's needed this to prove his innocence. Maybe if they had played this angle more I'd feel that he was robbed more and be more upset about what she did to him.
What Nicole did was wrong, it was an act of selfishness, it was an act of an insecure women who was offered her hearts desire and wasn't willing to risk losing it. But that's Nicole. If Eric truly loves her he's going to have to accept that she does these kind of things.
Also Nicole's pretty forgiving. She understands people make mistakes.
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gailwinters
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Jun 2 2014, 06:14 PM
Post #345
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- Pookie
- Jun 2 2014, 03:55 PM
Also a round of applause to the babies again. During Will's speech not only was she attentive, she actually looked concerned. Then looked over at Sonny when Will said his name! Never get rid of those two. The babies were so adorable today. The way she looked at Will, it was like she could understand every word, and then she looked at Sonny right on cue. So sweet!
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concerned
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Jun 2 2014, 06:14 PM
Post #346
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- KAM
- Jun 2 2014, 06:04 PM
- concerned
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- Yoryla
- Jun 2 2014, 03:43 PM
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- Jun 2 2014, 03:13 PM
Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
Really? Trying to kill Victor. Giving Chloe flesh-eating bacteria. Kidnapping Sami's child and making her think she's dead. Framing Jennifer for killing her unborn baby. Shredding the evidence.
Exactly what I was saying all of those events were pre started by another event not of Nicole's choosing. Victor hadn't of been keeping her as a virtual prisoner and had of left her leave she probably wouldn't have resorted to killing him. If Chloe had of stayed dead she wouldn't have needed to infect her face. If her baby hadn't of died she wouldn't have gone out and kidnapped Sami's kid. If her baby had of lived she wouldn't have framed Jennifer. If Eric hadn't of been drugged and raped Bad stuff happens to Nicole and she doesn't respond well and makes things worse. But she generally doesn't set out to do bad stuff.
I see your point that Nicole has not been a proactive schemer like Sami and some other Salemites. That's why she has so many sympathetic fans (including me) hoping she will someday find happiness. But really...isn't the true test of character in how a person responds to adversity in life? By the hard choices made in bad times? And your list could begin with this: If Nicole had left Salem to live with her true love, Eric 1, in Colorado, instead of staying to try to wreak vengeance on Victor, then..... Oh, and LOL at this one: " If Chloe had of stayed dead she wouldn't have needed to infect her face." How damned inconsiderate of Chloe! I mean, who among us would not have resorted to flesh eating bacteria after that? :blulaugh: :rolleyes: Only in Salem. LOL Would you give up on a person you had fallen in love with (especially when you had so little love in your life).
Chloe was gone, she was dead. Brady was falling in love with her.
It wasn't Nicole who faked Chloe's death it was Chloe and her mother.
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iheartwilson
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Jun 2 2014, 06:15 PM
Post #347
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- ladyofthelake
- Jun 2 2014, 05:59 PM
:popcorn: to some of the discussing going on here. Based on comments about CB's acting, I might have to watch and FF the Ericole scenes. Did I just say that? But I'm so pissed now about how they totally destroyed something..... As for who is right or wrong and what they deserve............PULEEZE. They both need their heads bashed together and be banished to isolation from Fetch. Come to think of it.....putting them in isolation...together....might not be a bad idea.... Fetch could go in that padded room they used in The Green Mile every time they get too involved in someone else's storyline.......Hmmmmmm No Ericole scenes in these clips from today.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cGGA5aEw86c&list=UUMsx8QgkfF8zR0Ruqj9Dw_A
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concerned
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Jun 2 2014, 06:17 PM
Post #348
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You know what would have been a great twist. If Gabi was covering for Sonny.
Gabi knows Sonny has covered for her all these months, she feels guilty about letting Nick into their lives and causing all this angst so she takes the fall for Sonny.
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PALMommy
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Jun 2 2014, 06:17 PM
Post #349
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- iheartwilson
- Jun 2 2014, 06:08 PM
- Ophelia
- Jun 2 2014, 05:26 PM
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- Jun 2 2014, 05:15 PM
Camilla! When she used her fingers to point to her eye and spoke of seeing Nick, I just marveled at what a really good actor she became while I watched. Then I thought what a damn shame she's right behind BB and about all the great scenes that could have been.
Eric is just ludicrous. What an asshole. I liked Nicole's explanation. Just wished she'd made as big a deal as Hope did about any evidence she and Douchial found being non-admissible in court. It would have bolstered her (actually good) argument. St. Eric DID tell her he chose her. I guess he did so because moving into the abbey with the creepy monk as a way to stay in the church didn't sound as pleasant as being with Nicole. This whole Catholic church won't forgive Eric Brady for his "sin" is ludicrous, anyway.
I agree, CB was just wonderful today. I agree with the others -- I wish she had gone into more detail about things getting physical with Nick and, specifically, that he had tried to rape her. I actually liked Nabi before it all went creepy-stalkery/abusive. At this point I'm willing to wait and see how Eric reacts. He just found out what Nicole did so I'm okay with him being pissed off. If she turns into the town pariah again, I'll be super-angry, though. The evidence was inadmissible in court and the Church may or may not have believed it was real, but we'll never know. I agree, the Church not forgiving him is a little ridiculous. As angry as I am that the writers made such an intolerable mess of the Ericole storyline, I'm more upset over the wasted potential. It would have been so fabulously angsty if Nicole had given him the evidence and Eric had gone back to the Church and begun pining over Nicole, realizing that being a priest isn't what he really wanted and that he was in it for the wrong reasons. So much glorious potential down the crapper. Thanks, idiots.
I never liked Nabi. I never liked Nick. I predicted creepy, abusive Nick back in 2012 when Nick found out Will was the father of Gabi's baby. The portmanteau of "Nabi" never fails to make me laugh!
Off topic: The only reason I want Eric and Jennifer as a couple is to say "Jeneric"! :blulaugh:
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concerned
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Jun 2 2014, 06:19 PM
Post #350
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Does anyone out their refer to their own kid as "the baby" particularly when you only have one.
Just seems odd to me.
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Ophelia
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Jun 2 2014, 06:20 PM
Post #351
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The evidence was inadmissible in court and the Church may or may not have believed it was real[.]
As I have pointed out before (but not in this thread), these arguments miss the point. Whether the evidence was admissible in court is irrelevant. Whether Eric would have been allowed to return to the priesthood on the strength of the evidence is irrelevant. More than anything else, what is relevant is that Nicole took away -- from the person she claims to love -- the one thing that could have given him peace of mind, the one thing that could have proven, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that he was innocent -- if not to anyone else, then at least to himself. Everything else that could have come out of her doing the right thing and giving him the evidence is secondary to that. No matter how sympathetic Nicole is or how good Arianne Zucker is at portraying her, what Nicole did was not an act of love, period. Eric has every right to be upset with her for as long as he wants to be. If the tables were turned and Nicole had learned that Eric had destroyed evidence that could have proven that her father had forced her into the porn industry and that she had never been a willing participant, I'm sure that she would have been livid, even if he'd had what he believed was a very good reason for doing so. I don't disagree with you, I just wasn't addressing that part of the argument in my post. I was replying to something specific in another poster's post.
There's nothing okay in what she did and I'm not defending her actions. I'm super-pissed that the writers went this route, enough that I'm pretty well done with watching and will read DR to see when the smoke clears. What also bothers me is the residual effect on Brady. In addition to the rest of the fallout, I don't think the Bricole friendship will ever be the same when he learns that she hid Kristen's evidence.
That said, I am Team Nicole. I will always be Team Nicole because of AZ. To me, being Team Nicole doesn't mean that I support all of her actions or think there's nothing wrong with the things she does, even though I may occasionally root for her to not be raked over the coals and hunted down by a mob with pitchforks every time she screws up. I root for Nicole to get her shit together, for her to have some shred of permanent happiness, for people to not constantly look down their noses at her, for her to address the reasons she sabotages her own happiness, for her to have better luck in the things she can't control. I want her to be a mother and a career woman and to find someone who accepts her flaws but embraces her spark. Also, I root for her for the same reasons I tend to root against the so-called heroes of Salem -- it is flat-out boring when someone wins ALL THE TIME, just as it is when someone loses ALL THE TIME (see: Nicole).
That doesn't mean I agree with what she did or that I've missed the point of why what she does is wrong. It just means I hate that they've sacrificed her redemption for a [Dannifer] plot point and desperately (!) hope they'll stop doing it.
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concerned
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Jun 2 2014, 06:21 PM
Post #352
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I know JS has always had a tendency to go all Laurence Olivier at the most odd times but it really stood out today.
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concerned
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Jun 2 2014, 06:25 PM
Post #353
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Oh Dear - So now even Gabi is brighter than EJ.
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Will&Sonny
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Jun 2 2014, 06:26 PM
Post #354
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- iheartwilson
- Jun 2 2014, 06:08 PM
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Camilla! When she used her fingers to point to her eye and spoke of seeing Nick, I just marveled at what a really good actor she became while I watched. Then I thought what a damn shame she's right behind BB and about all the great scenes that could have been.
Eric is just ludicrous. What an asshole. I liked Nicole's explanation. Just wished she'd made as big a deal as Hope did about any evidence she and Douchial found being non-admissible in court. It would have bolstered her (actually good) argument. St. Eric DID tell her he chose her. I guess he did so because moving into the abbey with the creepy monk as a way to stay in the church didn't sound as pleasant as being with Nicole. This whole Catholic church won't forgive Eric Brady for his "sin" is ludicrous, anyway.
I agree, CB was just wonderful today. I agree with the others -- I wish she had gone into more detail about things getting physical with Nick and, specifically, that he had tried to rape her. I actually liked Nabi before it all went creepy-stalkery/abusive. At this point I'm willing to wait and see how Eric reacts. He just found out what Nicole did so I'm okay with him being pissed off. If she turns into the town pariah again, I'll be super-angry, though. The evidence was inadmissible in court and the Church may or may not have believed it was real, but we'll never know. I agree, the Church not forgiving him is a little ridiculous. As angry as I am that the writers made such an intolerable mess of the Ericole storyline, I'm more upset over the wasted potential. It would have been so fabulously angsty if Nicole had given him the evidence and Eric had gone back to the Church and begun pining over Nicole, realizing that being a priest isn't what he really wanted and that he was in it for the wrong reasons. So much glorious potential down the crapper. Thanks, idiots.
I never liked Nabi. I never liked Nick. I predicted creepy, abusive Nick back in 2012 when Nick found out Will was the father of Gabi's baby. I predicted it even before that -- IMO, one of the first signs (aside from just the fact that he had been creepy and obsessive during his first stint on the show) was when he practically forced Gabi to say that she loved him.
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PALMommy
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Jun 2 2014, 06:29 PM
Post #355
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- Jun 2 2014, 06:19 PM
Does anyone out their refer to their own kid as "the baby" particularly when you only have one.
Just seems odd to me. I have an only child daughter and she's 12. I say "The Baby" or "The Girl" a lot.
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Ophelia
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Jun 2 2014, 06:30 PM
Post #356
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The evidence was inadmissible in court and the Church may or may not have believed it was real[.]
As I have pointed out before (but not in this thread), these arguments miss the point. Whether the evidence was admissible in court is irrelevant. Whether Eric would have been allowed to return to the priesthood on the strength of the evidence is irrelevant. More than anything else, what is relevant is that Nicole took away -- from the person she claims to love -- the one thing that could have given him peace of mind, the one thing that could have proven, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that he was innocent -- if not to anyone else, then at least to himself. Everything else that could have come out of her doing the right thing and giving him the evidence is secondary to that. No matter how sympathetic Nicole is or how good Arianne Zucker is at portraying her, what Nicole did was not an act of love, period. Eric has every right to be upset with her for as long as he wants to be. If the tables were turned and Nicole had learned that Eric had destroyed evidence that could have proven that her father had forced her into the porn industry and that she had never been a willing participant, I'm sure that she would have been livid, even if he'd had what he believed was a very good reason for doing so.
But Nicole never believed she was a willing participant in the porn thing. She knew she didn't choose to do it. And I haven't seen the angle where Eric has ever though he was a willing participant in the rape. There were some moments there early on when he thought it might of been Nicole who raped him where he was slightly unsure but even when he accused her he knew he wasn't a willing participant . Since he found out it was Kristen he's known (and all of the people close to him with the exception of Brady and EJ) have all known that he didn't willingly do it. I just haven't had a sense that he's needed this to prove his innocence. Maybe if they had played this angle more I'd feel that he was robbed more and be more upset about what she did to him. What Nicole did was wrong, it was an act of selfishness, it was an act of an insecure women who was offered her hearts desire and wasn't willing to risk losing it. But that's Nicole. If Eric truly loves her he's going to have to accept that she does these kind of things. Also Nicole's pretty forgiving. She understands people make mistakes. Eric really hasn't dealt with the aftermath of the rape yet, in my opinion. I don't know why they're choosing not to have him process it AT ALL. If it was going to come up, I would think it would have come up when he and Nicole were debating sex before marriage.
If you think about where Nicole was when Eric came to town -- she had hit bottom (again) and slowly worked her way back up into the community. She has no one to just anchor her to Salem. Theresa is in a similar situation, yet she has the Bradys to fall back on. Nicole has been on the canvas forever, but they have yet to give her a family member -- blood or otherwise -- so she can actually be part of Salem. It's ridiculous. It's also easy to understand why she had her moment of weakness with the evidence. I wish it had played out more at the end like it had at the beginning. Nicole was wracked with guilt constantly, but by the time Jennifer busted her, she was back to "lying to EJ" Nicole. It's lazy lazy writing and AZ couldn't even make it work. Of course, there wasn't much she could do when every other sentence contained "Daniel."
Edited by Ophelia, Jun 2 2014, 06:32 PM.
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concerned
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Jun 2 2014, 06:35 PM
Post #357
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Seriously parallels.
If Sami wasn't so goddamned clueless I'd be convinced they are foreshadowing that she is playing EJ.
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Grandpa Hughes
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Jun 2 2014, 06:36 PM
Post #358
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"Dedicated to the brotherhood of healing. "
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- concerned
- Jun 2 2014, 06:19 PM
Does anyone out their refer to their own kid as "the baby" particularly when you only have one.
Just seems odd to me. I have known lots of people who do that. I've been guilty of it myself. Guilty because the kids weren't really babies and I still called them that.
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six
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Jun 2 2014, 06:45 PM
Post #359
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Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
It's hard to hate a character who continually gets shit on year after year after year. Nicole is in the wrong, however, she still comes off as the sympathetic one here because of all the shit she's been through and because AZ is brilliant. The writers are fucking idiots. :flipoff:
I don't really get that when most of her "shit" have been totally her own doing.
She really should stop choosing to have miscarriages and stillbirths and get cheated on and have dead girlfriends come back to life. She doesn't handle these thing well (she handles them atrociously) but she generally doesn't start the ball rolling. All villains lash out for a reason. Almost all of Nicole's misfortunes can be traced back to something stupid and/or illegal that she did.
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concerned
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Jun 2 2014, 06:46 PM
Post #360
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- Grandpa Hughes
- Jun 2 2014, 06:36 PM
- concerned
- Jun 2 2014, 06:19 PM
Does anyone out their refer to their own kid as "the baby" particularly when you only have one.
Just seems odd to me.
I have known lots of people who do that. I've been guilty of it myself. Guilty because the kids weren't really babies and I still called them that. Ok it's just me then.
I don't even refer to the dogs or cat as "the cat", or "the dog" I refer to them by their names.
(although I don't have a name for my car it is just the car).
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