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Vivian Jovanni on the rape storyline; mini-interview on Digest website
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Topic Started: Feb 17 2016, 05:19 PM (8,073 Views)
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leighland
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Feb 18 2016, 08:13 AM
Post #61
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- Hugo
- Feb 18 2016, 06:09 AM
I get the people saying it's too soon to judge this story but at the same time, I think there are several reasons to think it's already off to a bad start.
I don't think VJ is the right actress for this, she's weak and a lot of fans have been complaining about her. The writers should have been careful not to portray Chase as a likable misunderstood teenager and should have insisted more on his dark side over the past few weeks. Andre's involvement in the story is also a bad idea, it feels like the goal is to shift the blame (or at least some of it) on him when Chase is the guilty one. And the writers also added the fact that Ciara has some feelings for Chase, insinuating that she wanted it.
If you do a rape story, you should make sure there won't be a lot of fans who will feel bad for the rapist or will easily find excuses to his behavior and I don't think the writers have done that well so far. There's also the fact that some will perceive this story as throwing a character they like under the bus to prop a character they don't like and that usually backfires. I could imagine this story having a negative impact on the victims out there if they feel that there's a lot of fan support for Chase. Even if that fan support is not about defending rape, it might be perceived that way.
I don't know. Maybe I'm making false assumptions and that's not how this story will be perceived but I'm worried. When the show turned Nick into a homophobe, I was pleasantly surprised how most of the viewers stood up for Will and Sonny, I didn't see many people trying to defend Nick's actions. And the writing wasn't for this story wasn't even that great. People have complained about AS and MB's acting and, IMO, VJ is no weaker than either of them. And, judging by the stuff the latter two pulled in October and January respectively, I would say she's far better in emotional scenes than they are. In fact, if she opened her mouth VJ would improve significantly.
Giving a character sympathetic properties is part of compelling storytelling. Most famous villains have sympathetic pasts, but those in no way excuse anything they have done or are currently doing. Chase being likeable is subjective and him being misunderstood is more or less Higley's inability to do her job. This Chase is more like the November Chase that was playing with matches. JG's Chase.
No matter how good a story is, a fan of that character can and, a lot of the time, will find excuses to make. See yesterday's thread with people latching on to hope that Chase might be drugged. And for a lot of fans, if a character isn't portrayed the way they like they feel that character is under the bus.
While Ciara liking Chase is kind of out of the blue, girls being raped by boys they like is not uncommon. That makes the "we both want this" significant and I can see him trying to use that as an excuse.
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The Scorpion
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Feb 18 2016, 08:17 AM
Post #62
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- Lovejm
- Feb 18 2016, 07:58 AM
- The Scorpion
- Feb 18 2016, 07:14 AM
My opinion is that Daytime is far behind when it comes to storytelling if compared with primetime, I wonder if the day will come when everything in Daytime fit? What I mean is the characters feels ok and it is exciting stories and you think it's worth watching a half hour or hour, for it is so exciting. Days should trim their cast and writing more exciting characters. Everything feels mediocre right now on Days. And old super couples from a bygone era is not what attracts me.
Old supercouples may not attract you but a lot of people like them. And they certainly haven't eaten the show alive (looking at you Hope). Soap operas need strong families and to tell stories across multiple generations. I actually think for the first time in a long time Days is doing that. From Victor's story, to S&K and J&M, to the Belle/Brady/Shawn D age group and then the teens. I understand what you saying, and the family drama can be good but I prefer big stories who contains infidelity, passion, betrayal, etc. with couples in the age range of 30 years to the age of 40 years , it gets so corny with "old super couples" their storys have been told already. Today, they have grown up kids so I feel story should focus more on their children's lives and their drama. With that said Rape story is not something that interests me, I think they should have been able to tell far more interesting stories with teenagers. Ciara could have been a bad girl, and as stir up trouble or what ever.
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Lovejm
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Feb 18 2016, 08:24 AM
Post #63
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- The Scorpion
- Feb 18 2016, 08:17 AM
- Lovejm
- Feb 18 2016, 07:58 AM
- The Scorpion
- Feb 18 2016, 07:14 AM
My opinion is that Daytime is far behind when it comes to storytelling if compared with primetime, I wonder if the day will come when everything in Daytime fit? What I mean is the characters feels ok and it is exciting stories and you think it's worth watching a half hour or hour, for it is so exciting. Days should trim their cast and writing more exciting characters. Everything feels mediocre right now on Days. And old super couples from a bygone era is not what attracts me.
Old supercouples may not attract you but a lot of people like them. And they certainly haven't eaten the show alive (looking at you Hope). Soap operas need strong families and to tell stories across multiple generations. I actually think for the first time in a long time Days is doing that. From Victor's story, to S&K and J&M, to the Belle/Brady/Shawn D age group and then the teens.
I understand what you saying, and the family drama can be good but I prefer big stories who contains infidelity, passion, betrayal, etc. with couples in the age range of 30 years to the age of 40 years , it gets so corny with "old super couples" their storys have been told already. Today, they have grown up kids so I feel story should focus more on their children's lives and their drama. With that said Rape story is not something that interests me, I think they should have been able to tell far more interesting stories with teenagers. Ciara could have been a bad girl, and as stir up trouble or what ever. I actually don't want to see those types of infidelity/marital problem type stories for the super couples anyway so we agree lol. I also want those types of big stories you mentioned for their children's age group anyway, I just think there's a place for the supercouples as parents who also have their own lives. They're still a little 'young' to be relegated to what Doug and Julie do.
It's funny because I know I've been complaining for J&M in particular I'd rather see them supporting the kids as well more recently. They've been alone a lot the last few months. John was a good start with the Belle Philip stuff the other day and I'm hoping to see Marlena with Belle. I've pretty much given up on Brady with them
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The Scorpion
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Feb 18 2016, 08:25 AM
Post #64
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- thepadange
- Feb 18 2016, 07:39 AM
- The Scorpion
- Feb 18 2016, 07:14 AM
My opinion is that Daytime is far behind when it comes to storytelling if compared with primetime, I wonder if the day will come when everything in Daytime fit? What I mean is the characters feels ok and it is exciting stories and you think it's worth watching a half hour or hour, for it is so exciting. Days should trim their cast and writing more exciting characters. Everything feels mediocre right now on Days. And old super couples from a bygone era is not what attracts me.
Primetime shows don't produce 250 episodes a year and their shows don't last 50+ years. It's like comparing apples to oranges. That was not my point, Storytelling is much better on primetime than Daytime and the characters are more interesting on primetime. Ex new series Shades of Blue contains the dirty cops like Hope and Rafe, and there is a difference between how to put up the story and describes the characters and their motivations. So even if there is a difference in the episodes, storytelling should not be much difference. Just saying.
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PALMommy
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Feb 18 2016, 08:30 AM
Post #65
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- The Room Stops
- Feb 17 2016, 05:58 PM
- Fafokahw
- Feb 17 2016, 05:46 PM
- No1_ILoveLucyFan
- Feb 17 2016, 05:40 PM
I didn't like the idea of the storyline at first, and in no universe do I condone what Chase did -- regardless of what Andre said to him.
But, I'm not familiar with Josh's work either and having seen the pics of DHer with VJ, it gives me a glimmer of hope that they will play this out as it should be - a crime, and won't try to romanticize it in any way.
That's right I'd forgotten about that pic Dee posted with VJ thanks for reminding me No1_ILoveLucyFan. Like you I hope it ends up with Ciara getting long term counseling from Marlena. Hope is too mentally gone right now to see any of the signs and Hope was never raped thankfully some close calls but at this point she won't know the signs and someone like Jenn who would know is too doped up with her own health problems. The only other person who i want to see heavily involved in this story is Aunt/Stepgrandma Julie who was raped as well and helped out Jenn with her issues 25 years ago.
Yes! Marlena was also raped, so having her be the therapist has good beats to play too. Both Hope and Julie could come to her with their concerns, and Marlena notices the signs, Julie asks her point blank (she's Julie) if she thinks there's a chance. Maybe she even sees her around Chase (since Ciara probably won't tell anyone at first, which is sadly very common, especially for someone so young). It'd be a good way to bring back the rape seminars they did in the 80s. It can never be reiterated too much how it is about power, not sex, and that it is never, ever the victim's fault. I'm glad people (on social media) are finding it so uncomfortable though. It should be. Rape is a sore, uncomfortable, important subject. I mean, the person who said "I like Chase, Ciara deserved it" made me want to stab him verbally with a pitchfork in his eyes, but other than that... at least people are reacting when they see it happen. Outrage is the right response to anyone being violated. And hopefully DAYS follows up with a responsible storyline. HOLY CRAP ON A CRACKER!?!?
Did someone here say that?
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boogie
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Feb 18 2016, 09:14 AM
Post #66
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While Chase didn't seem like someone who would do this I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing. I hear all the time how so & so was such a nice guy and wouldn't never do that. So while yes Chase raping Ciara came out of nowhere but, that's how it happens sometimes. Though some rapes occur with strangers there are a lot that happen with someone that you know.
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KweenBoda
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Feb 18 2016, 09:18 AM
Post #67
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I watched the rape scene and it struck me how young Chase looks..really really young. A desperate kid who felt he was losing everything he had left after losing his father did something so horrific that he might never come back from it. I feel so bad for both of them...Yes I feel more for Ciara as she was the victim in this case but I feel some sympathy for Chase too..so shoot me lol
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thepadange
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Feb 18 2016, 09:30 AM
Post #68
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- The Scorpion
- Feb 18 2016, 08:25 AM
- thepadange
- Feb 18 2016, 07:39 AM
- The Scorpion
- Feb 18 2016, 07:14 AM
My opinion is that Daytime is far behind when it comes to storytelling if compared with primetime, I wonder if the day will come when everything in Daytime fit? What I mean is the characters feels ok and it is exciting stories and you think it's worth watching a half hour or hour, for it is so exciting. Days should trim their cast and writing more exciting characters. Everything feels mediocre right now on Days. And old super couples from a bygone era is not what attracts me.
Primetime shows don't produce 250 episodes a year and their shows don't last 50+ years. It's like comparing apples to oranges.
That was not my point, Storytelling is much better on primetime than Daytime and the characters are more interesting on primetime. Ex new series Shades of Blue contains the dirty cops like Hope and Rafe, and there is a difference between how to put up the story and describes the characters and their motivations. So even if there is a difference in the episodes, storytelling should not be much difference. Just saying. Things I mentioned earlier influence the storytelling. There's also a significant difference in budget, schedule etc, etc.
And not everything in primetime is all that great either.
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boogie
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Feb 18 2016, 09:35 AM
Post #69
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- leighland
- Feb 18 2016, 08:13 AM
- Hugo
- Feb 18 2016, 06:09 AM
I get the people saying it's too soon to judge this story but at the same time, I think there are several reasons to think it's already off to a bad start.
I don't think VJ is the right actress for this, she's weak and a lot of fans have been complaining about her. The writers should have been careful not to portray Chase as a likable misunderstood teenager and should have insisted more on his dark side over the past few weeks. Andre's involvement in the story is also a bad idea, it feels like the goal is to shift the blame (or at least some of it) on him when Chase is the guilty one. And the writers also added the fact that Ciara has some feelings for Chase, insinuating that she wanted it.
If you do a rape story, you should make sure there won't be a lot of fans who will feel bad for the rapist or will easily find excuses to his behavior and I don't think the writers have done that well so far. There's also the fact that some will perceive this story as throwing a character they like under the bus to prop a character they don't like and that usually backfires. I could imagine this story having a negative impact on the victims out there if they feel that there's a lot of fan support for Chase. Even if that fan support is not about defending rape, it might be perceived that way.
I don't know. Maybe I'm making false assumptions and that's not how this story will be perceived but I'm worried. When the show turned Nick into a homophobe, I was pleasantly surprised how most of the viewers stood up for Will and Sonny, I didn't see many people trying to defend Nick's actions. And the writing wasn't for this story wasn't even that great.
People have complained about AS and MB's acting and, IMO, VJ is no weaker than either of them. And, judging by the stuff the latter two pulled in October and January respectively, I would say she's far better in emotional scenes than they are. In fact, if she opened her mouth VJ would improve significantly. Giving a character sympathetic properties is part of compelling storytelling. Most famous villains have sympathetic pasts, but those in no way excuse anything they have done or are currently doing. Chase being likeable is subjective and him being misunderstood is more or less Higley's inability to do her job. This Chase is more like the November Chase that was playing with matches. JG's Chase. No matter how good a story is, a fan of that character can and, a lot of the time, will find excuses to make. See yesterday's thread with people latching on to hope that Chase might be drugged. And for a lot of fans, if a character isn't portrayed the way they like they feel that character is under the bus. While Ciara liking Chase is kind of out of the blue, girls being raped by boys they like is not uncommon. That makes the "we both want this" significant and I can see him trying to use that as an excuse. VJ isn't the best actress but, she is young and this is her first acting gig. I think the teens deserve some time to get better. There's an actress on GH who plays Kiki who was really bad when she first started and she has gotten significantly better as an actress. Though I'm still not a big fan of her character but, I can acknowledge that she has gotten better. The teen scene really hasn't much of a story up until now. And, look at RSW everyone complained about him but, when he became crazy serial killer Ben people where singing his praises to the point that they thought he was robbed of getting an emmy nom.
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sitrian
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Feb 18 2016, 09:41 AM
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- KweenBoda
- Feb 18 2016, 09:18 AM
I watched the rape scene and it struck me how young Chase looks..really really young. A desperate kid who felt he was losing everything he had left after losing his father did something so horrific that he might never come back from it. I feel so bad for both of them...Yes I feel more for Ciara as she was the victim in this case but I feel some sympathy for Chase too..so shoot me lol I agree, what happened to Ciara, of course, was horriific. But I feel bad for Chase. He's adrift and he's lost everything and he feels his last solid connection slipping away and he acts out in the worst way possible. I think there is a redemption arch for Chase here and I don't mind that. So long as his redemption doesn't go through coupledom with Ciara.
I'm not "yay, a rape story" because gross. But if this story is well tol and Ciara gets to react appropriately? Then it could be a very, very good story. I don't think I have enough info to judge right now and i reserve the right to hate it later.
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rknudson78
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Feb 18 2016, 10:12 AM
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What gets me is right in the living room where anybody could walk in.
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Days22
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Feb 18 2016, 01:44 PM
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I only want to see an attempt at redeeming Chase if he actually goes to jail. A step we hardly seem to see on rape stories (and in real life). One thing they got right with Todd Manning even tho he was still an SOB at that point.
Edited by Days22, Feb 18 2016, 01:45 PM.
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lysie
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Feb 18 2016, 01:59 PM
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- thepadange
- Feb 18 2016, 09:30 AM
- The Scorpion
- Feb 18 2016, 08:25 AM
- thepadange
- Feb 18 2016, 07:39 AM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep Daytime is far behind when it comes to storytelling if compared with primetime
That was not my point, Storytelling is much better on primetime than Daytime and the characters are more interesting on primetime. Ex new series Shades of Blue contains the dirty cops like Hope and Rafe, and there is a difference between how to put up the story and describes the characters and their motivations. So even if there is a difference in the episodes, storytelling should not be much difference. Just saying.
Things I mentioned earlier influence the storytelling. There's also a significant difference in budget, schedule etc, etc. And not everything in primetime is all that great either. Yeah there should be a pretty obvious difference in storytelling between daytime and primetime for many reasons. If primetime had to do as much as daytime, their characters would suffer too. Hell, that's why so many shows lose their way after a couple of seasons. There are some things I wish soaps would take from primetime (I mentioned them last week) but watching a soap and hoping to see primetime television is a lost cause. Daytime soap operas are daytime soap operas, not primetime dramas. And age of the characters shouldn't make a damn bit of difference. It certainly doesn't in primetime.
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rknudson78
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Feb 18 2016, 02:01 PM
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So far Ciara is doing good in her performances.
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nananana7
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Feb 18 2016, 06:48 PM
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[twitter=soapcentral/status/700433562445705216]
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Snowing Fan
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Feb 18 2016, 06:51 PM
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Rape stories maybe good for an actor to play,but I am sick,sick,sick of them on DOOL.
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The Room Stops
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Feb 18 2016, 07:26 PM
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- PALMommy
- Feb 18 2016, 08:30 AM
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- Feb 17 2016, 05:46 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Yes! Marlena was also raped, so having her be the therapist has good beats to play too. Both Hope and Julie could come to her with their concerns, and Marlena notices the signs, Julie asks her point blank (she's Julie) if she thinks there's a chance. Maybe she even sees her around Chase (since Ciara probably won't tell anyone at first, which is sadly very common, especially for someone so young). It'd be a good way to bring back the rape seminars they did in the 80s. It can never be reiterated too much how it is about power, not sex, and that it is never, ever the victim's fault. I'm glad people (on social media) are finding it so uncomfortable though. It should be. Rape is a sore, uncomfortable, important subject. I mean, the person who said "I like Chase, Ciara deserved it" made me want to stab him verbally with a pitchfork in his eyes, but other than that... at least people are reacting when they see it happen. Outrage is the right response to anyone being violated. And hopefully DAYS follows up with a responsible storyline. HOLY CRAP ON A CRACKER!?!? Did someone here say that? No, someone on Facebook. I've never seen anyone here be anywhere near THAT insane.
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Amazee-Dayzee
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Feb 19 2016, 05:47 AM
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I can't believe they would do it so close together to Steve's rape though. That is the thing that bothers me the most. Poor Bo must be rolling in his grave right now. First his best friend gets raped by a psycho that caused his father's death and now his daughter is raped by the son of his ex-wife's 4th husband.
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goo3
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Feb 19 2016, 06:19 AM
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- Snowing Fan
- Feb 18 2016, 06:51 PM
Rape stories maybe good for an actor to play,but I am sick,sick,sick of them on DOOL. Its a standard go-to plot for untalented writers and it tends to lessen the seriousness of the crime in my opinion.
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lazydazes
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Feb 19 2016, 06:20 AM
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DAYS just needs to stay away from rape storylines if they're not going to tell them responsibly. When will they actually tell one where the rapist goes to jail and stays? I have no sympathy for Chase whatsoever in this. It's all about Ciara---she's the real victim. If DAYS wants to tackle a real social issue, show it like it really is for teen girls that are too afraid to come forward after it happens. The shame, horror, and fear that they feel should be shown. I challenge all soaps to break the rape storyline trend if they're not going to portray it for the violent crime that it is. As for Chase, I don't care about his potential 'redemption arc' or what happens to him. The show is going all out to paint him as the victim, and I'm sure that the blame will be shifted to Andre eventually. The show has already botched the Chase/Theo bullying element as well. Chase bullied this poor, innocent autistic kid, but we're supposed to be worried about him? Nah, not me. Rather than focusing on Theo, the actual bullying victim, the show was too busy throwing a pity party for Chase. Again, another social issue that the show failed on. Shouldn't the actual story have been about Theo's struggles and fears? Right, didn't happen. Chase has problems. But, what kid on the show doesn't? And the fact that he has problems isn't an excuse for the damage that he has caused both Theo and Ciara. More than that, most adult offenders have a history of anti-social behavior from the very beginning and it just doesn't spring up out of the blue. The fact that Chase is already displaying violent behavior is believable.
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