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Jason47's Weekly Thread: Week of 2/29-3/6; Today's episode ties two "Days" records, plus Tamara Braun removed from credits today...
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Topic Started: Feb 29 2016, 02:16 PM (3,695 Views)
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Hugo
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Mar 2 2016, 04:45 PM
Post #21
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- Jason47
- Mar 2 2016, 04:13 PM
TAMARA BRAUN REMOVED FROM CREDITS TODAY...
Tamara Braun was removed from the credits today, so Ava's brief appearance to Joey yesterday seems to have been her last appearance. Day made! :yahoo: I thought she would haunt Joey, Steve and Kayla for another month. So glad I won't have to endure more Ava on my screen. Despicable character.
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Hugo
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Mar 2 2016, 04:50 PM
Post #22
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- No1_ILoveLucyFan
- Mar 2 2016, 04:35 PM
- Jason47
- Mar 2 2016, 04:20 PM
TODAY'S EPISODE TIES "DAYS" RECORDS FOR LEAST AMOUNT OF SETS...AND LEAST AMOUNT OF SCENES FOR AN HOUR EPISODE...
Today's episode tied two "Days" records: only one set (Brady Pub) and only 8 scenes (the least amount possible since the show expanded to an hour in 1975):
3/2/16: Abe, Caroline, Hope, John, Kate, Marlena, Roman, Stefano, Victor, Lexie (FBO). Sets: Brady Pub & Exterior.
Proof that less is more, cause today's episode was damn good stuff IMO. Curious to see what the ratings will say, if they will go up or down for this episode and the episode after.
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am103
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Mar 2 2016, 05:08 PM
Post #23
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- No1_ILoveLucyFan
- Mar 2 2016, 04:35 PM
- Jason47
- Mar 2 2016, 04:20 PM
TODAY'S EPISODE TIES "DAYS" RECORDS FOR LEAST AMOUNT OF SETS...AND LEAST AMOUNT OF SCENES FOR AN HOUR EPISODE...
Today's episode tied two "Days" records: only one set (Brady Pub) and only 8 scenes (the least amount possible since the show expanded to an hour in 1975):
3/2/16: Abe, Caroline, Hope, John, Kate, Marlena, Roman, Stefano, Victor, Lexie (FBO). Sets: Brady Pub & Exterior.
Proof that less is more, cause today's episode was damn good stuff IMO. Couldn't have said it better. Days doesn't always need to be flashy and crazy to be good. Which is why there's no excuse as to why it can't be good all the time.
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DiMera87
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Mar 2 2016, 05:41 PM
Post #24
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- Hugo
- Mar 2 2016, 04:50 PM
- No1_ILoveLucyFan
- Mar 2 2016, 04:35 PM
- Jason47
- Mar 2 2016, 04:20 PM
TODAY'S EPISODE TIES "DAYS" RECORDS FOR LEAST AMOUNT OF SETS...AND LEAST AMOUNT OF SCENES FOR AN HOUR EPISODE...
Today's episode tied two "Days" records: only one set (Brady Pub) and only 8 scenes (the least amount possible since the show expanded to an hour in 1975):
3/2/16: Abe, Caroline, Hope, John, Kate, Marlena, Roman, Stefano, Victor, Lexie (FBO). Sets: Brady Pub & Exterior.
Proof that less is more, cause today's episode was damn good stuff IMO.
Curious to see what the ratings will say, if they will go up or down for this episode and the episode after. It's clearly a stand-alone "Very Special Episode" so I don't think the ratings will say anything. Even if someone absolutely loved it, they should know that tomorrow won't have anything to do with it. Same goes for anyone that hated it.
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lysie
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Mar 2 2016, 05:42 PM
Post #25
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- DiMera87
- Mar 2 2016, 05:41 PM
- Hugo
- Mar 2 2016, 04:50 PM
- No1_ILoveLucyFan
- Mar 2 2016, 04:35 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deepTODAY'S EPISODE TIES "DAYS" RECORDS FOR LEAST AMOUNT OF SETS...AND LEAST AMOUNT OF SCENES FOR AN HOUR EPISODE...
Curious to see what the ratings will say, if they will go up or down for this episode and the episode after.
It's clearly a stand-alone "Very Special Episode" so I don't think the ratings will say anything. Even if someone absolutely loved it, they should know that tomorrow won't have anything to do with it. Same goes for anyone that hated it. And regardless of what the ratings do, I'm not sure what the implication would be. More clip shows? Fewer clip shows? The ratings for this day aren't going to have anything to do with anything and aren't going to indicate anything about anything. It wasn't advertised, so they weren't counting on it do anything. :shrug:
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ohgreatone22
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Mar 2 2016, 09:02 PM
Post #26
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What were the dates of the flashbacks?
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Jason47
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Mar 2 2016, 09:18 PM
Post #27
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- ohgreatone22
- Mar 2 2016, 09:02 PM
What were the dates of the flashbacks? They aren't working again until April, so I can't check until then.
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anya
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Mar 3 2016, 03:24 PM
Post #28
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- Jason47
- Mar 2 2016, 09:18 PM
- ohgreatone22
- Mar 2 2016, 09:02 PM
What were the dates of the flashbacks?
They aren't working again until April, so I can't check until then. Wow.
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Sindacco
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Mar 3 2016, 07:49 PM
Post #29
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- ohgreatone22
- Mar 2 2016, 09:02 PM
What were the dates of the flashbacks? Do you mean the ones of Stefano on Wednesday's show?
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Jason47
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Mar 4 2016, 12:00 PM
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- Sindacco
- Mar 3 2016, 07:49 PM
- ohgreatone22
- Mar 2 2016, 09:02 PM
What were the dates of the flashbacks?
Do you mean the ones of Stefano on Wednesday's show? That's the ones I'm assuming.
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Hugo
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Mar 4 2016, 12:30 PM
Post #31
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I wonder if Joe Mascolo will be removed from the credits today.
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samskara2012
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Mar 4 2016, 06:29 PM
Post #32
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- Jason47
- Mar 2 2016, 04:13 PM
TAMARA BRAUN REMOVED FROM CREDITS TODAY...
Tamara Braun was removed from the credits today, so Ava's brief appearance to Joey yesterday seems to have been her last appearance. This makes me so sad. With everything they could have done with the character, and they did THIS! All I can say is that I'm not watching any more. I just can't take all the entitlement going on with Kayla, Joey and Steve. I'll repost what I did on another board about how I feel about Ava.
My main issue with this whole mess is how is it that Roman, Kayla and Steve have the gall to tell Ava to "stay away from Salem" when she's an American citizen. The Vitali's had a villa in Tuscany, I know that. But that the writing had all three of them telling her to leave the country. Hello, she's an American! No one has the right to tell an American they cannot stay in their country of birth. That is just plain hubris in their behalf. What also got me were the many times Steve outrightly choked Ava out. Yeah, that makes him a hero in my books....Only NOT! I was a huge Steve Johnson fan back in the 80s, and I loved Steve and Kayla, but what happened this time around with both of them and their over-inflated egos when it came to Ava has turned me off of them. I actually can say I hate them. They deserve each other, quite honestly. Both are insipid and disgusting characters. Now I know some will say that Ava is worse, but I'll counter with this.... Everyone is saying they're glad Stefano is gone because of all the trouble he caused.... Well Ava wouldn't have become like she did if not for Stefano's intervention. While yes at the chapel where Steve and Ava were getting married Steve bolted because, and gasp eek gads (insert gratuitous pandering moment) he "remembered" there was someone else out there, but that he went to go back to talk to Ava but Stefano's men grabbed him up.... That caused Ava to have her breakdown and Martino to get the psychiatrist to start drugging her up to also cover up the fact Martino murdered her mother and stole her baby. I'd have to say that Ava is a more sympathetic character in all of this. Kayla, Steve and Roman's sense of entitlement at being able to tell Ava where she could go and where she couldn't stay is one of the reasons I will always hate these three characters I once loved. That and as I said Steve's proclivity to keep choking her out. I don't recall him using such disgusting tactics with the woman who had the dagger tattoo who told him about Bo back in September. I'm not going to hide the fact I'm an Ava fan and I feel like these three people will be given a walk and Joey's actions will be excused all because he's the child of the "Golden Two". But I feel all of them were complicit in Ava's fate. That's why I'm no longer watching. I can't get behind a show that will excuse their actions but continue to vilify Ava's. It's too much of "pot calling kettle" for me.
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esp13
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Mar 4 2016, 06:59 PM
Post #33
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- samskara2012
- Mar 4 2016, 06:29 PM
- Jason47
- Mar 2 2016, 04:13 PM
TAMARA BRAUN REMOVED FROM CREDITS TODAY...
Tamara Braun was removed from the credits today, so Ava's brief appearance to Joey yesterday seems to have been her last appearance.
This makes me so sad. With everything they could have done with the character, and they did THIS! All I can say is that I'm not watching any more. I just can't take all the entitlement going on with Kayla, Joey and Steve. I'll repost what I did on another board about how I feel about Ava. My main issue with this whole mess is how is it that Roman, Kayla and Steve have the gall to tell Ava to "stay away from Salem" when she's an American citizen. The Vitali's had a villa in Tuscany, I know that. But that the writing had all three of them telling her to leave the country. Hello, she's an American! No one has the right to tell an American they cannot stay in their country of birth. That is just plain hubris in their behalf. What also got me were the many times Steve outrightly choked Ava out. Yeah, that makes him a hero in my books....Only NOT! I was a huge Steve Johnson fan back in the 80s, and I loved Steve and Kayla, but what happened this time around with both of them and their over-inflated egos when it came to Ava has turned me off of them. I actually can say I hate them. They deserve each other, quite honestly. Both are insipid and disgusting characters. Now I know some will say that Ava is worse, but I'll counter with this.... Everyone is saying they're glad Stefano is gone because of all the trouble he caused.... Well Ava wouldn't have become like she did if not for Stefano's intervention. While yes at the chapel where Steve and Ava were getting married Steve bolted because, and gasp eek gads (insert gratuitous pandering moment) he "remembered" there was someone else out there, but that he went to go back to talk to Ava but Stefano's men grabbed him up.... That caused Ava to have her breakdown and Martino to get the psychiatrist to start drugging her up to also cover up the fact Martino murdered her mother and stole her baby. I'd have to say that Ava is a more sympathetic character in all of this. Kayla, Steve and Roman's sense of entitlement at being able to tell Ava where she could go and where she couldn't stay is one of the reasons I will always hate these three characters I once loved. That and as I said Steve's proclivity to keep choking her out. I don't recall him using such disgusting tactics with the woman who had the dagger tattoo who told him about Bo back in September. I'm not going to hide the fact I'm an Ava fan and I feel like these three people will be given a walk and Joey's actions will be excused all because he's the child of the "Golden Two". But I feel all of them were complicit in Ava's fate. That's why I'm no longer watching. I can't get behind a show that will excuse their actions but continue to vilify Ava's. It's too much of "pot calling kettle" for me. I'm not sure why I'm bothering but . . .
Nobody told Ava where she could live. They gave her a choice. Leave the county OR face charges for assaulting and kidnapping Kayla. She could have totally chosen to stay in the United States. It was her choice to (pretend) to agree to leave. If she wanted to stay in the US, she certainly could have. It's not like they were telling her to leave because they just didn't like her. It was a trade-off for not putting her in jail.
And even if I agreed that somehow everything that happened to Ava was Stefano's fault (which I don't, given that she was willing to marry a man without a name or a memory), that excuse doesn't work when she targets Steve and Kayla instead of Stefano. Kayla didn't do ANYTHING to Ava. In the last storyline, she not only figured out her drug addiction, she worked to cure her of it. She did nothing to Ava. Yet, Ava still came back and targeted her family again. Ava is not some poor victim of Roman and Kayla (the people who's father she killed).
As for Steve and his manhandling, it's not my favorite aspect of his character. But, it's hard to have sympathy when Ava has Kayla hostage and is taunting Steve about his son.
The only person complicit in Ava's fate was Ava. Steve and Kayla didn't go looking for her. She showed up on their doorstep with a lie, and having already manipulated their son. She chose to go down the road with her assault and kidnapping of Kayla as well as her "blackmail" of Steve. Then she tried to frame Kayla yet again. What did Kayla ever do that actually deserved any of that? Not like Ava? Not trust her? Since when are those things crimes? Trying to turn this into some story of Ava the victim is ridiculous. She may (I repeat, may) have been a victim of her father and/or Stefano. But she wasn't a victim of Steve or Kayla. She made them her victims. And that makes it pretty easy to excuse their actions. Call it self-defense, self-preservation, or just plain old reaching the end of the rope. Ava put them there and I'm not sorry she's finally gone.
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samskara2012
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Mar 4 2016, 07:28 PM
Post #34
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- esp13
- Mar 4 2016, 06:59 PM
- samskara2012
- Mar 4 2016, 06:29 PM
- Jason47
- Mar 2 2016, 04:13 PM
TAMARA BRAUN REMOVED FROM CREDITS TODAY...
Tamara Braun was removed from the credits today, so Ava's brief appearance to Joey yesterday seems to have been her last appearance.
This makes me so sad. With everything they could have done with the character, and they did THIS! All I can say is that I'm not watching any more. I just can't take all the entitlement going on with Kayla, Joey and Steve. I'll repost what I did on another board about how I feel about Ava. My main issue with this whole mess is how is it that Roman, Kayla and Steve have the gall to tell Ava to "stay away from Salem" when she's an American citizen. The Vitali's had a villa in Tuscany, I know that. But that the writing had all three of them telling her to leave the country. Hello, she's an American! No one has the right to tell an American they cannot stay in their country of birth. That is just plain hubris in their behalf. What also got me were the many times Steve outrightly choked Ava out. Yeah, that makes him a hero in my books....Only NOT! I was a huge Steve Johnson fan back in the 80s, and I loved Steve and Kayla, but what happened this time around with both of them and their over-inflated egos when it came to Ava has turned me off of them. I actually can say I hate them. They deserve each other, quite honestly. Both are insipid and disgusting characters. Now I know some will say that Ava is worse, but I'll counter with this.... Everyone is saying they're glad Stefano is gone because of all the trouble he caused.... Well Ava wouldn't have become like she did if not for Stefano's intervention. While yes at the chapel where Steve and Ava were getting married Steve bolted because, and gasp eek gads (insert gratuitous pandering moment) he "remembered" there was someone else out there, but that he went to go back to talk to Ava but Stefano's men grabbed him up.... That caused Ava to have her breakdown and Martino to get the psychiatrist to start drugging her up to also cover up the fact Martino murdered her mother and stole her baby. I'd have to say that Ava is a more sympathetic character in all of this. Kayla, Steve and Roman's sense of entitlement at being able to tell Ava where she could go and where she couldn't stay is one of the reasons I will always hate these three characters I once loved. That and as I said Steve's proclivity to keep choking her out. I don't recall him using such disgusting tactics with the woman who had the dagger tattoo who told him about Bo back in September. I'm not going to hide the fact I'm an Ava fan and I feel like these three people will be given a walk and Joey's actions will be excused all because he's the child of the "Golden Two". But I feel all of them were complicit in Ava's fate. That's why I'm no longer watching. I can't get behind a show that will excuse their actions but continue to vilify Ava's. It's too much of "pot calling kettle" for me.
I'm not sure why I'm bothering but . . . Nobody told Ava where she could live. They gave her a choice. Leave the county OR face charges for assaulting and kidnapping Kayla. She could have totally chosen to stay in the United States. It was her choice to (pretend) to agree to leave. If she wanted to stay in the US, she certainly could have. It's not like they were telling her to leave because they just didn't like her. It was a trade-off for not putting her in jail. And even if I agreed that somehow everything that happened to Ava was Stefano's fault (which I don't, given that she was willing to marry a man without a name or a memory), that excuse doesn't work when she targets Steve and Kayla instead of Stefano. Kayla didn't do ANYTHING to Ava. In the last storyline, she not only figured out her drug addiction, she worked to cure her of it. She did nothing to Ava. Yet, Ava still came back and targeted her family again. Ava is not some poor victim of Roman and Kayla (the people who's father she killed). As for Steve and his manhandling, it's not my favorite aspect of his character. But, it's hard to have sympathy when Ava has Kayla hostage and is taunting Steve about his son. The only person complicit in Ava's fate was Ava. Steve and Kayla didn't go looking for her. She showed up on their doorstep with a lie, and having already manipulated their son. She chose to go down the road with her assault and kidnapping of Kayla as well as her "blackmail" of Steve. Then she tried to frame Kayla yet again. What did Kayla ever do that actually deserved any of that? Not like Ava? Not trust her? Since when are those things crimes? Trying to turn this into some story of Ava the victim is ridiculous. She may (I repeat, may) have been a victim of her father and/or Stefano. But she wasn't a victim of Steve or Kayla. She made them her victims. And that makes it pretty easy to excuse their actions. Call it self-defense, self-preservation, or just plain old reaching the end of the rope. Ava put them there and I'm not sorry she's finally gone. You know, I'm willing to see some of what you're saying, but everything that transpired was a direct result of Stefano and Martino's actions. Sorry to have to burst your Steve & Kayla loving bubble. It doesn't matter that Ava agreed to marry a man with no memory or whatever, the point here is that Steve wounded her by leaving the chapel. And as I said with the writers pandering to the fans to throw them that bone. So with that action, Steve was kidnapped back by Stefano. Ava comes out to talk to "Patch" and finds him gone. She won't know they whys or the hows until later, but she has her breakdown. Her father has to hospitalize her and has her drugged up so that a) she doesn't reveal what she knows about what he did to her mother, and b) takes her baby once it's born to sell it in to the baby market where the baby dies due to bad health conditions. If this were any other character other than Ava Vitali, I would say they'd get way more sympathy than Ava did. So my guess has to be it's only because she dared to come in between the "Golden Couple" and their "blissful happiness". As for her choice of target.... She didn't know until later it was Stefano who took Steve from the chapel, the point of it all is that Kayla was the one who had Steve's love, a love she was never allowed to have given the pandering to the fans in that regard. And face it, it was pandering.
As for the plane and Shawn Sr.'s death, she atoned for that by Bo's killing her father. Quid pro quo I'd say. Bo got his revenge so to bring that up is moot.
But my point is this in this whole mess, the writers screwed up royally with this storyline. And the talent that Tamara brought to this show is now gone. As a fan of her's I'm sickened that this was how the story went down and I'm sorry to have to say this, but both Steve and Kayla are now tarnished to me because to me Ava's actions can be understood if you look at it through her eyes. Which I can do, and it's hard to sympathize with any of these "do gooders" when the story is heavily weighted in only one outcome, and that is the justification of choking her out. It wasn't manhandling, it was outright choking. And Ava only acted on Kayla with braining her when she got all uppity about this supposed thing Kayla suspected with Joey. She also "promised" to tell Steve not to help in finding his and Ava's son. Again, regardless of the reasons, Kayla once again believed she was above Ava by believing she had the right to tell Steve not to help find a child that was his. Whether that child was dead (which I feel was a cop out by Griffith to once again pander to the Steve and Kayla fans) is moot. Even you have to agree this whole story was mucked up from the jump. With all the other options they had to go, this ending was the one that was decided upon and the road leading up to it was messy and incongruous when you consider again where Ava was the last time we saw her in August 2008.
Like I said, I'm not watching any more. And giant "if" here, "if" they brought Tamara back at a later date as Ava, the viewers are already weighted against her. This Tamara fan would like to know why this decision was made to begin with in having her relatively unchanged from the last time we saw her. I know I tweeted to Tamara about the fact I was disappointed and appalled at what was done to Ava and she liked my tweet and answered me back with a lot of question marks. So even she's confused as to why they went this way. But my point is this, Steve, Kayla, and Roman don't make it out of this unscathed. And I don't see how it's right that so many of these so-called denizens of Salem get off with their criminal behaviour. Bo's shooting of Martino I can understand. To a degree Hope's shooting Stefano, I can understand considering both Martino and Stefano's long history of corruption and terror (Martino's only mentioned, not shown). However, I'll never ever condone Steve's choking Ava out and smothering someone to death as Joey did.
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Deverauxfan
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Mar 4 2016, 07:48 PM
Post #35
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Bellarke <3
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Ava kidnapped Kayla and raped Steve. She was a villain that viewers weren't meant to sympathize with. Ava made Steve and Kayla her victims.
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Kriss4
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Mar 4 2016, 07:53 PM
Post #36
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Are you never critical of Ava's actions?
She comes to town with a "poor me, I'm dying and I need your forgiveness" lie. What do Steve and Kayla do but try to forgive her for causing Pop's death?
She pulls Joey into her lie, using a naive boy to get information on Steve and Kayla. When Kayla calls her on it, Ava attacks her physically and holds her hostage without food or water to force Steve to comply with what she wants, even using Kayla's fate to get him to sleep with her.
She tapes the act. If a guy did that, he'd be a disgusting example of humanity, right? Therefore, she, too, is a disgusting example of humanity.
As if that's not enough, she decides to frame Kayla for attempted murder. Kayla, who, though she didn't like or trust her, still made an effort to help her (pills), and tried to forgive her, even though she cost Kayla's dad his life.
I figure any character who's done what Ava's done was gonna come to a bad end eventually.
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granolagirl
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Mar 4 2016, 08:34 PM
Post #37
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#SorryNotSorry
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What baffles me the most is the idea that Ava was justified, because Steve leaving her at the altar made her a victim. It was at least 20 years ago in the show time. And who hasn't been left at the altar once or twice? As they say, she needs to build a bridge and get over it.
(Sorry Jason! :wave:)
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esp13
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Mar 4 2016, 09:19 PM
Post #38
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- samskara2012
- Mar 4 2016, 07:28 PM
- esp13
- Mar 4 2016, 06:59 PM
- samskara2012
- Mar 4 2016, 06:29 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deepTAMARA BRAUN REMOVED FROM CREDITS TODAY...
I'm not sure why I'm bothering but . . . Nobody told Ava where she could live. They gave her a choice. Leave the county OR face charges for assaulting and kidnapping Kayla. She could have totally chosen to stay in the United States. It was her choice to (pretend) to agree to leave. If she wanted to stay in the US, she certainly could have. It's not like they were telling her to leave because they just didn't like her. It was a trade-off for not putting her in jail. And even if I agreed that somehow everything that happened to Ava was Stefano's fault (which I don't, given that she was willing to marry a man without a name or a memory), that excuse doesn't work when she targets Steve and Kayla instead of Stefano. Kayla didn't do ANYTHING to Ava. In the last storyline, she not only figured out her drug addiction, she worked to cure her of it. She did nothing to Ava. Yet, Ava still came back and targeted her family again. Ava is not some poor victim of Roman and Kayla (the people who's father she killed). As for Steve and his manhandling, it's not my favorite aspect of his character. But, it's hard to have sympathy when Ava has Kayla hostage and is taunting Steve about his son. The only person complicit in Ava's fate was Ava. Steve and Kayla didn't go looking for her. She showed up on their doorstep with a lie, and having already manipulated their son. She chose to go down the road with her assault and kidnapping of Kayla as well as her "blackmail" of Steve. Then she tried to frame Kayla yet again. What did Kayla ever do that actually deserved any of that? Not like Ava? Not trust her? Since when are those things crimes? Trying to turn this into some story of Ava the victim is ridiculous. She may (I repeat, may) have been a victim of her father and/or Stefano. But she wasn't a victim of Steve or Kayla. She made them her victims. And that makes it pretty easy to excuse their actions. Call it self-defense, self-preservation, or just plain old reaching the end of the rope. Ava put them there and I'm not sorry she's finally gone.
You know, I'm willing to see some of what you're saying, but everything that transpired was a direct result of Stefano and Martino's actions. Sorry to have to burst your Steve & Kayla loving bubble. It doesn't matter that Ava agreed to marry a man with no memory or whatever, the point here is that Steve wounded her by leaving the chapel. And as I said with the writers pandering to the fans to throw them that bone. So with that action, Steve was kidnapped back by Stefano. Ava comes out to talk to "Patch" and finds him gone. She won't know they whys or the hows until later, but she has her breakdown. Her father has to hospitalize her and has her drugged up so that a) she doesn't reveal what she knows about what he did to her mother, and b) takes her baby once it's born to sell it in to the baby market where the baby dies due to bad health conditions. If this were any other character other than Ava Vitali, I would say they'd get way more sympathy than Ava did. So my guess has to be it's only because she dared to come in between the "Golden Couple" and their "blissful happiness". As for her choice of target.... She didn't know until later it was Stefano who took Steve from the chapel, the point of it all is that Kayla was the one who had Steve's love, a love she was never allowed to have given the pandering to the fans in that regard. And face it, it was pandering. As for the plane and Shawn Sr.'s death, she atoned for that by Bo's killing her father. Quid pro quo I'd say. Bo got his revenge so to bring that up is moot. But my point is this in this whole mess, the writers screwed up royally with this storyline. And the talent that Tamara brought to this show is now gone. As a fan of her's I'm sickened that this was how the story went down and I'm sorry to have to say this, but both Steve and Kayla are now tarnished to me because to me Ava's actions can be understood if you look at it through her eyes. Which I can do, and it's hard to sympathize with any of these "do gooders" when the story is heavily weighted in only one outcome, and that is the justification of choking her out. It wasn't manhandling, it was outright choking. And Ava only acted on Kayla with braining her when she got all uppity about this supposed thing Kayla suspected with Joey. She also "promised" to tell Steve not to help in finding his and Ava's son. Again, regardless of the reasons, Kayla once again believed she was above Ava by believing she had the right to tell Steve not to help find a child that was his. Whether that child was dead (which I feel was a cop out by Griffith to once again pander to the Steve and Kayla fans) is moot. Even you have to agree this whole story was mucked up from the jump. With all the other options they had to go, this ending was the one that was decided upon and the road leading up to it was messy and incongruous when you consider again where Ava was the last time we saw her in August 2008. Like I said, I'm not watching any more. And giant "if" here, "if" they brought Tamara back at a later date as Ava, the viewers are already weighted against her. This Tamara fan would like to know why this decision was made to begin with in having her relatively unchanged from the last time we saw her. I know I tweeted to Tamara about the fact I was disappointed and appalled at what was done to Ava and she liked my tweet and answered me back with a lot of question marks. So even she's confused as to why they went this way. But my point is this, Steve, Kayla, and Roman don't make it out of this unscathed. And I don't see how it's right that so many of these so-called denizens of Salem get off with their criminal behaviour. Bo's shooting of Martino I can understand. To a degree Hope's shooting Stefano, I can understand considering both Martino and Stefano's long history of corruption and terror (Martino's only mentioned, not shown). However, I'll never ever condone Steve's choking Ava out and smothering someone to death as Joey did. It was pandering? Steve and Kayla were a supercouple long before Ava was ever dreamt up. And the were back together and having a child when Ava showed back up. Showing thst Kayla is Steve's "true love" isn't pandering, it's canon. Steve remembering enough to run out of the wedding wasn't pandering, it was a connection. It's been true for every supercouple. It's what makes a supercouple.
And you talk about Ava being robbed, what about Kayla? She lost 16 years with her husband. What about Steve who endured years of torture and brainwashing? What did they do to deserve "punishment" from Ava.
And you know what, Ava might have deserved sympathy, but she lost all of it with how she acted and the things she did. Bo killing Marino in self-defense doesn't retroactively justify her killing an innocent man like Shawn, Sr. Kayla being angry about Ava using Joey doesn't justify assault and kidnapping. Ava made a deliberate choice to destroy the Johnsons. Whatever difficulties she had in her life doesn't justify that decision.
The one thing we can agree on is the writing of the story sucked. And since I think TB is a good actress and a pretty amazing person, I am sorry she got stuck is that crappy story. But my feelings about Ava are based on what happened onscreen, not what could have happened if the story was written differently.
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Sindacco
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Mar 4 2016, 09:57 PM
Post #39
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- Jason47
- Mar 4 2016, 12:00 PM
- Sindacco
- Mar 3 2016, 07:49 PM
- ohgreatone22
- Mar 2 2016, 09:02 PM
What were the dates of the flashbacks?
Do you mean the ones of Stefano on Wednesday's show?
That's the ones I'm assuming. Okey... I got most of them.
Roman: August 21, 2008 Abe: August 11, 2000 Kate: September 24, 2009 Victor: April 7, 2009 Marlena 1: May 1994 Marlena 2: July 25, 1996 John: June 1, 2012
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cord08
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Mar 4 2016, 10:23 PM
Post #40
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- granolagirl
- Mar 4 2016, 08:34 PM
What baffles me the most is the idea that Ava was justified, because Steve leaving her at the altar made her a victim. It was at least 20 years ago in the show time. And who hasn't been left at the altar once or twice? As they say, she needs to build a bridge and get over it.
(Sorry Jason! :wave:) I agree with you, but the bolded made me laugh. :blulaugh: Ah, soaps!
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