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Monday, March 7th Episode Discussion
Topic Started: Mar 6 2016, 07:54 PM (18,513 Views)
Rosebud
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Restless84
Mar 7 2016, 05:22 PM
Was Victor around Brady when he was a baby? He made it sound like he was.
He was... Mostly to give him gifts and to visit with John to try to get him to pursue Marlena :D
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JoeBucs32


Guess they're making Kate back into a hooker. She seems to have Brady-brain lately.
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Rosebud
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esp13
Mar 7 2016, 05:51 PM
Restless84
Mar 7 2016, 05:41 PM
esp13
Mar 7 2016, 05:35 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
He fears that they won't. I just don't care that they set it up that way. If they actually have Henry say that they end up being understanding (if they take the story that far), I'll be pleasantly surprised.
Okay. But it's not exactly a fable that some very religious people are also very anti-gay. One of the issues I had with Will's coming out is that people who should have had issues with it (Caroline, Eric) had none. Caroline is very Catholic and older and it would have been a common thing for her have concerns/reservations/issues with Will being gay. It doesn't mean they have to be hateful/damning. Same with Eric as a priest. He could have been concerned without being hateful.

I don't have great faith in this show doing things with nuance, but a coming out story that was more true to life (i.e. not everyone thinking it was the greatest thing ever) would do more to actually show the truth about the difficulties in coming out and the way a family can evolve during that time would be nice.
I didn't have a problem at all with Eric or Caroline's reactions to Will. Just because Caroline is "very Catholic" doesn't automatically mean she is going to be concerned about him coming out. That's stereotyping older, "very" Catholic people. My mother is the most Catholic person I know and still goes to mass daily and was so happy when gay marriage was made legal, she even put that rainbow thing on her Facebook profile pic. She's 81.
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Rosebud
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esp13
Mar 7 2016, 06:08 PM
CatherineEarnshaw
Mar 7 2016, 05:59 PM
Marlena was pilloried by many in the community but Alice and Caroline both stood up for her. I see them doing the same for Will. Who I think should have had a problem with is Roman
Again, for a lot of very religious, pro-family people (not all, or most, but many) having an affair is far more forgivable than being gay. Caroline's attitude towards Marlena's affair (particularly in light of her own) really doesn't mean anything in regards to her total acceptance of Will.

And it's not that I want people to be un-accepting. But part of telling a good story is exploring the conflicts inherent to the story. For millions and millions of Americans, coming out to family and friends wasn't nearly as easy as it was for Will. It cost them relationships, it cost them their families, and sometimes their children. And removing almost all of that from Will's story was, IMO, unfortunate. It was a compelling story, but it could have been even more if they had told the whole story.
For me, if Caroline had had an issue with Will it would have seemed out of character. It would have bothered me. I don't get your qualification of her being judgemental about gays but not adultery. Just because she had an affair, she's not judgemental about that but would be about homosexuals? Because she isn't gay, she couldn't understand that but cuz she had an affair she gets that? I tend to think she's just not a judgemental person, and just wouldn't have a tendency to judge.
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Deverauxfan
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Bellarke <3

She was being hypothetical. Will's coming out storyline is over anyway. :shrug: She was just saying that it may have been better if they had some characters have reservations about Will's coming out and not everyone accepting it so easily.
Edited by Deverauxfan, Mar 7 2016, 10:34 PM.
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granolagirl
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#SorryNotSorry

I don't think there is necessarily a direct connection between forgiving adultery and accepting gay marriage. For socially conservative people, they can be seen as two very different kinds of sins. And sometimes forgiving adultery has a lot to do with the value of keeping families together.

Caroline was much more conservative and judgmental in the 80's. I have a hard time reconciling strip club Caroline sometimes with the way she used to be. They did show her trying to grow and accept things a little even back then, though.

Not that it matters, but I know older Catholics who fall on different sides of the gay issue.
Edited by granolagirl, Mar 7 2016, 10:55 PM.
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wallflower
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Rosebud
Mar 7 2016, 09:45 PM
esp13
Mar 7 2016, 05:51 PM
Restless84
Mar 7 2016, 05:41 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Okay. But it's not exactly a fable that some very religious people are also very anti-gay. One of the issues I had with Will's coming out is that people who should have had issues with it (Caroline, Eric) had none. Caroline is very Catholic and older and it would have been a common thing for her have concerns/reservations/issues with Will being gay. It doesn't mean they have to be hateful/damning. Same with Eric as a priest. He could have been concerned without being hateful.

I don't have great faith in this show doing things with nuance, but a coming out story that was more true to life (i.e. not everyone thinking it was the greatest thing ever) would do more to actually show the truth about the difficulties in coming out and the way a family can evolve during that time would be nice.
I didn't have a problem at all with Eric or Caroline's reactions to Will. Just because Caroline is "very Catholic" doesn't automatically mean she is going to be concerned about him coming out. That's stereotyping older, "very" Catholic people. My mother is the most Catholic person I know and still goes to mass daily and was so happy when gay marriage was made legal, she even put that rainbow thing on her Facebook profile pic. She's 81.
Your mother sounds like a very nice and open-minded lady.

My 80 year old father was raised Lutheran and he was so upset when he heard that "Neil" from "White Collar" is gay in real life he acted like I had ruined the whole show for him by telling him about it.

Although I can understand why my Dad feels the way he does, I have to admit I`m a little disappointed.

To each his own, I guess.


ETA: Dad refuses to go near Facebook or any part of the Internet.
Edited by wallflower, Mar 7 2016, 11:08 PM.
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Rosebud
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Deverauxfan
Mar 7 2016, 10:34 PM
She was being hypothetical. Will's coming out storyline is over anyway. :shrug: She was just saying that it may have been better if they had some characters have reservations about Will's coming out and not everyone accepting it so easily.
If you're replying to me... I didn't bring up Will :shrug: but Since tha story was brought up I have a right to disagree with her hypothetical desire to have seen Caroline have objections to his coming out and say why I think that.
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wallflower
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Deverauxfan
Mar 7 2016, 10:34 PM
She was being hypothetical. Will's coming out storyline is over anyway. :shrug: She was just saying that it may have been better if they had some characters have reservations about Will's coming out and not everyone accepting it so easily.
Lucas did have a problem with it for a while.
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esp13
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Rosebud
Mar 7 2016, 09:45 PM
esp13
Mar 7 2016, 05:51 PM
Restless84
Mar 7 2016, 05:41 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Okay. But it's not exactly a fable that some very religious people are also very anti-gay. One of the issues I had with Will's coming out is that people who should have had issues with it (Caroline, Eric) had none. Caroline is very Catholic and older and it would have been a common thing for her have concerns/reservations/issues with Will being gay. It doesn't mean they have to be hateful/damning. Same with Eric as a priest. He could have been concerned without being hateful.

I don't have great faith in this show doing things with nuance, but a coming out story that was more true to life (i.e. not everyone thinking it was the greatest thing ever) would do more to actually show the truth about the difficulties in coming out and the way a family can evolve during that time would be nice.
I didn't have a problem at all with Eric or Caroline's reactions to Will. Just because Caroline is "very Catholic" doesn't automatically mean she is going to be concerned about him coming out. That's stereotyping older, "very" Catholic people. My mother is the most Catholic person I know and still goes to mass daily and was so happy when gay marriage was made legal, she even put that rainbow thing on her Facebook profile pic. She's 81.
You're right, it doesn't mean she would automatically feel that way. I mean obviously she didn't. And I think it's great that your mother was so accepting.

My point wasn't that all older Catholics would feel a particular way. My point was only that I believe the story would have been enhanced by some conflict and Caroline, IMO, would have been the type of character who would have had a logical basis for that conflict. That's it.
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esp13
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Rosebud
Mar 7 2016, 10:26 PM
esp13
Mar 7 2016, 06:08 PM
CatherineEarnshaw
Mar 7 2016, 05:59 PM
Marlena was pilloried by many in the community but Alice and Caroline both stood up for her. I see them doing the same for Will. Who I think should have had a problem with is Roman
Again, for a lot of very religious, pro-family people (not all, or most, but many) having an affair is far more forgivable than being gay. Caroline's attitude towards Marlena's affair (particularly in light of her own) really doesn't mean anything in regards to her total acceptance of Will.

And it's not that I want people to be un-accepting. But part of telling a good story is exploring the conflicts inherent to the story. For millions and millions of Americans, coming out to family and friends wasn't nearly as easy as it was for Will. It cost them relationships, it cost them their families, and sometimes their children. And removing almost all of that from Will's story was, IMO, unfortunate. It was a compelling story, but it could have been even more if they had told the whole story.
For me, if Caroline had had an issue with Will it would have seemed out of character. It would have bothered me. I don't get your qualification of her being judgemental about gays but not adultery. Just because she had an affair, she's not judgemental about that but would be about homosexuals? Because she isn't gay, she couldn't understand that but cuz she had an affair she gets that? I tend to think she's just not a judgemental person, and just wouldn't have a tendency to judge.
No, I wasn't saying that Caroline couldn't be understanding because she wasn't gay. Growing up and living in a very conservative and highly religious state, I'm very aware that many such folks are far more forgiving of adultery than of homosexuality. If that has not been your experience than I'm thrilled for you for living in such enlightened communities.

But not all communities are like that. And not all conservative religious people are either. My point, again, was simply that I felt the Will coming out story would have been enhanced by some realistic conflict and Caroline "could" have provided that.
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Deverauxfan
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Bellarke <3

Rosebud
Mar 7 2016, 11:07 PM
Deverauxfan
Mar 7 2016, 10:34 PM
She was being hypothetical. Will's coming out storyline is over anyway. :shrug: She was just saying that it may have been better if they had some characters have reservations about Will's coming out and not everyone accepting it so easily.
If you're replying to me... I didn't bring up Will :shrug: but Since tha story was brought up I have a right to disagree with her hypothetical desire to have seen Caroline have objections to his coming out and say why I think that.
The conversation was about Will and how his family reacted to his coming out. :)
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moniker11


I absolutely love the vibe between Drake and A Martinez. It's a nice contrast to John's relationship with Roman, Abe, and Steve. These two together mean business and I can't wait till they go in guns blazing to protect their family.

Adorable scenes with Marlena/Gabi/Arianna. Those little girls are amazingly cute. At first I was a little disappointed they didn't show the kidnapping because lately all the physical scenes with Marlena have been first rate but I get it. Those girls are way too young for something like that and I can totally believe that would disturb segments of the audience. That said I love that this story is finally, truly getting started.

Love the continued Petrov mentions and John's reaction at the end to the picture he was sent.

Paul is fantastic and it's great he took the time to talk to Henry. I'm kinda hoping Henry sticks around.

Thankfully I FF'd through Brady/Summer because I am so done with Brady pretending he does not in fact have two parents who raised him in town.

Go JJ for telling Abby the truth. She needed to know.
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laurondo
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Aw a Will mention.

lol Deimos' line about waiting 30 years. You just met her, calm down.
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laurondo
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Theresa's hair color doesn't look good in this scene.
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laurondo
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Maggie's outfit is really ugly.
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laurondo
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...Isn't Clyde in jail in Florida? Then why do they keep saying Clyde's going to get Ben through customs to leave the country??
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laurondo
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Ken Adams
Mar 7 2016, 02:33 PM
How is Brady legally able to get the DNA test results for Summer? Isn't that against some sort of law? Just wondering.
Pfft, nah. They make their own rules just like the PD - you know, where a serial killer escapes and the only cop that knows is the one that JUST graduated the academy.

I wish this show didn't think we were all dumbasses sometimes, lol
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Lovejm


For the recap there may be two smaller cuts yesterday. I didn't see Abby suggest Jen needs surgery. And Eduardo wasn't show getting the text from the kidnappers. Just John did
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Aquamarine
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Lovejm
Mar 8 2016, 07:40 AM
For the recap there may be two smaller cuts yesterday. I didn't see Abby suggest Jen needs surgery. And Eduardo wasn't show getting the text from the kidnappers. Just John did
I did hear Abby suggest that Jennifer get physical therapy, but I don't remember hearing anything about surgery.
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